Atheists, God and the afterlife.

A group for members of all religions, or no religion at all, to talk about religion

  1. truthseeker17

    truthseeker17 Fapstronaut

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    First of all I do not seek to put down or desecrate the Holy Bible. It is a critical matter of faith for Muslims to believe in the original revelations that came down to Moses, David, Solomon and Jesus, just as it is important for Muslims to believe in the revelation of the Quran that came to Muhammad (peace be upon him).The key word here however, is "original." As we all know the origin of the Bible is clouded with centuries of copying, translating and passing down information, now long lost with only copies of manuscripts remaining to remind us of what once was the Bible.

    Additionally, it should be noted that Muslims do not seek to destroy the Christians or Jews belief in the Word of God, rather it is an obligation for Muslims to call to what is right and to halt that which is evil.

    I believe from all the religious books Qur'an is the most clear, accurate and original book from God Himself. Qur'an is the only book which is still remained in the original language, got just one version and is memorized by millions. Qur'an is also the only book where God Himself speaks in first person to mankind. In Qur'an God Himself describes Himself to us. Qur'an challanges people. for example: "If this (Quran) were from other than Allah, you would find within it many contradictions."
    Qur'an is the biggest, living miracle for mankind. Many scientific miracles have been found in Qur'an. Qur'an talks detailed about embryology, science, astronomy, history, economics and many other matters. Most important, Qur'an is for all mankind and jinn(another creation of Allah, similar to humans in that they could make choices as to whether or not they would obey God's Commandments, and they existed before humans)


    Muslims should respect the Bible because it does still contain some of the original teachings of Allah. But there is no need to go to Bible classes or purchase one to read to try to learn about what our purpose is here in this life. The Qur'an makes it clear that Allah has indeed, perfected our "way of life" for us and has conferred on us His favor and has chosen for us to submit to Him in Islam.

    I would like to suggest to the non-Muslims to consider obtaining a Qur'an and then investigate for themselves what the Quran is really all about and what it might mean to them in their lives.

    reference notes:
    http://www.bibleislam.com/bible_vs_quran.php
    http://www.bibleislam.com/
     
  2. Castielle

    Castielle Fapstronaut

    Here's my one question: how do you know this book is "from God Himself" when it was written by one man? How is it possible to be sure that it wasn't just soemthing that guy made up because he thought it sounded nice? None of the other things you mentioned matter at all... whether it's in the original language or that "God" speaks in first person. I've written plenty of first person stories. It's a style choice, chosen by the author.

    The Qur'an just simply does not have the confirmation of 40 different authors and the corroboration of over 1,000 years of time to back up it's legitimacy.
     
    RainbowShell likes this.
  3. Personally I am not religious for one reason, my intense curiosity. I've been to church a few times but it never clicked with me. My #1 question right now is why does everyone's religion work for them? Try to grasp this Christianity works for christians they feel support within god and a great community to be involved with. But the same thing goes for Islamic faiths, Buddhism etc. maybe there is more than one god ?¿ Maybe people find peace in meditation. inner peace is all that matters?And if I go to hell it is my destiny for I did not choose to accept faith. I would not think of God cruelly if he did as you were saying, I'm not here to say that but why would he condemn people of different beliefs? I know there is no answer this is just how I feel. Or why would he let kids die of cancer and go to hell because they weren't religious. Doesn't seem a little unfair? Everyone is delt a different hand
     
  4. I don't know about all the religious shit and I don't care God is leaving me alone so I will leave him alone
     
  5. It's not up for debate what we are describing right now because God doesn't focus on forces is to be religious
     
  6. tweeby

    tweeby Banned

    @Kdot your just going through a moral crisis . . . I will keep you in my prayers.
     
  7. Buzz Lightyear

    Buzz Lightyear Fapstronaut

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    It's an interesting one. From the theoretical perspective, the fact of multiple religions counts as a negative. However, from the pragmatic perspective [and, if anything, I am a pragmatist], it counts as a positive - the fact of multiple religions would suggest we are a religious animal of sorts... just as we are, or can be, a political one. We seem to be, from the psychological perspective, a believing animal, and even if we can not know with exact certainty the absolute truth, we still have to choose our poison.. so to speak. Pure science, or pure logic, comes to us after a long process, and is a choice we make ourselves.

    But rising like a superstructure on the base of pragmatism, we still have reason at play, though now less strictly and purely epistemological, and prepared more to settle for coherent and rational beliefs... not to mention desirable ones. And Christianity, with its rich traditions and histories, hopes, promises and premises, then appears attractive in an otherwise cold and hostile world. It is after all a love story.
     
    Last edited: Dec 3, 2017
  8. Interesting point. Can you point to specific corroborated prophecies? I've only read Genesis and a decent amount of the New Testament.

    I would personally be wary of the numerous authors point. On the basis that they aren't exactly independent. The later authors had probably read the earlier ones and the contemporaneous ones (such as the gospels) probably had many overlapping primary sources.

    And, if you don't mind, how did you decide your denomination of Christianity? Really not attacking, just curious as to your thinking on that point.
     
  9. Castielle

    Castielle Fapstronaut

    That's true, but I would still be much more able to accept something like that, even giving an allowance for a bit of confirmation bias, than a religion created by one person.

    I've tried out various churches and had friends from various churches that were very different from mine, and I just liked mine best, I suppose. I grew up going to a Christian Missionary and Alliance church (whatever that means, I'm honestly not entirely sure lol) and now I attend a non-denominational church. It wasn't so much about the name of the denomination as it was about the feel of the church and the way they teach. I had a friend who I knew had very similar beliefs to me, and he grew up in the church I'm currently attending, so that's part of why I chose to try it out. And I really liked the Pastors and the things they teach and the way they teach them, and I like the worship style, which is not hyper hippie-ish, but still open to some freedom of expression. But again, I don't think people of other denominations are necessarily "wrong," they just have different preferences and emphasize different parts of the word. For example, my old church got a new Pastor shortly before I left it, and their teaching started to become a lot more simplistic. Sort of more of a good teaching for new Christians, not so much people who want more depth and study. Which isn't bad, but it just wasn't for me.

    I can, but it will take me some time to do so, and I'm really busy right now. I promise I'm not deflecting. Lol I will get back to you on that. :)
     
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  10. Castielle

    Castielle Fapstronaut

    http://www1.cbn.com/biblestudy/biblical-prophecies-fulfilled-by-jesus

    I didn't read all of this. I don't necessarily agree with some of them, like the Psalms. I'm not sure it's really accurate to say they are prophecies of Jesus, when they could just be talking about something completely different. But some of them are pretty direct.

    https://www.biblestudytools.com/bib...-filled-with-fulfilled-prophecy-11652232.html
    Again, I didn't read all of this, but this article seems to be referring more to historical prophecies, rather than specifically prophecies about Jesus. So, something different than the first.

    @AverageBear I can look into this more, if you'd like, when I have the time, but those are some things for you to start with, I suppose.
     
  11. AChosenPeople

    AChosenPeople Fapstronaut

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    Yes. One and the same. Just different Names for Him.
     
  12. truthseeker17

    truthseeker17 Fapstronaut

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    ehh... that's completely incorrect. I have no idea of Jehovah... but Jesus is definitely not the same as "Allah ". Despite this I do believe the original message of the religions came from one source. Some just got badly modified by time and people.
     
  13. Castielle

    Castielle Fapstronaut

    I would also disagree with this. Lol not to start an argument, but just saying.
     
  14. AChosenPeople

    AChosenPeople Fapstronaut

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    Allah is what the people of islam call God. God has come to the earth in flesh form, as Jesus on Earth to die in order for our sins to be forgiven. So, these Names are used to describe God, although these Names might be misused and misunderstood.
     
  15. Castielle

    Castielle Fapstronaut

    But Muslims don't believe in this. So, no, Allah is definitely not the same as Jesus, in accordance to their religion.
     
  16. AChosenPeople

    AChosenPeople Fapstronaut

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    They don't believe in this, I didn't say they do, but these Names are for a fact one and the same God.
     
  17. AChosenPeople

    AChosenPeople Fapstronaut

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    wether they believe it or not, God came as Jesus on earth to forgive our sins. And no, eating pork won't get you in hell and drinking alcohol is as bad as stealing one cent or disbelieving God in any way.
     
  18. AChosenPeople

    AChosenPeople Fapstronaut

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    While Jesus had absolutely commited no sin, Mohammed had sex with 9 year old kid. And with multiple women.
     
  19. Castielle

    Castielle Fapstronaut

    I'm not sure what would make you say they are names for the same God when the religion that uses the name Allah (Islam) has completely different beliefs than Christianity. They are not the same. That's like saying Buddah is just another name for Jesus. Doesn't make any sense to me, but it's not really that important to this discussion anyway.
     
    Ginny Weasley likes this.
  20. AChosenPeople

    AChosenPeople Fapstronaut

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    They may have different beliefs, but the name Allah points to God. The same God that came as Jesus to earth, wether you, or them believe it or not.
     

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