RIP Hugh Hefner

As a woman, I'm probably even more shocked than you are. It's incredibly sad. These women clearly don't understand the meaning of self respect. Or the meaning of the word "empowerment," for that matter.

 

Interestingly Hefner had a really strict religious upbringing.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news...-childhood-to-playboy/?utm_term=.4d15679962f1

It kind of was like my upbringing so I can relate in that regards... I wouldn't be surprised if his upbringing played a part in him starting Playboy.

I won't say I hope he burns in hell because I think if there is a hell Annihilationism is the correct interpretation of 'hell' and I think this 'fire' talked about in scripture is a metaphor.

 

Degrading to an acceptable way? That's a complete oxymoron, unless you're a terrible person. How can something be degrading and also acceptable?

 

Yeah, probably. That doesn't make it acceptable, though, or any less degrading. It just makes it *feel* less degrading and more acceptable because you've been desensitized.

 

Feel degraded. Once a chick spreads her legs so so millions of guys around the world can jerk to then moves in to a mansion with a bunch of other hoes to get banged by the same old man, it actually becomes official.

 

Yeah, exactly. Whether or not someone "feels degraded" is irrelevant. There are plenty of rape victims and victims of kidnapping and spousal or parental sexual abuse who *feel* totally loved and like the person abusing them would never possibly do anything to harm them.

 

Hell yeah. Now I understand I degrade myself everytime I PMO but I didnt see it that way for years.

 

I agree. I think he was a pretty terrible person, but I don't ever wish for anyone to burn in hell.

 

Um, purpose, obviously. Although guys may jack off to lingerie models, that's not their purpose. Their purpose is to make the clothes their client is selling look good. The ONLY purpose of playboy is for men to leer at the women and drool over them. That's a huge difference. I'm not sure why I even have to explain this difference, because it's incredibly obvious.

Criticism is not the same thing as degradation and objectification... I don't even know how to answer this question or why you've asked it. They're completely unrelated.

Good for you... my opinion is different. I shared my opinion, I never said everyone has to agree with it.

 

And for every one of those men, I guarantee there are 10 others who think of her as a piece of meat designed for their pleasure. Just because some people don't see it that way doesn't mean she isn't being degraded and objectified. Maybe she isn't by those men, but she certainly is by someone.

And even looking at someone as a goddess or a piece of art is objectifying as well. It takes away her humanity. They are not longer seeing her as a person with thoughts and ideas and flaws and illnesses and struggles and family. That's still objectifying. It's less problematic objectifying, but still objectifying nonetheless.

I disagree that those are the same. A bunch of black people saying the N word to each other is only going to hurt someone if they feel offended by it. A woman becoming a Playboy model could damage her significantly, whether she *feels* degraded and objectified or not. I don't think you understand the psychological damage a position like that can do to a woman, whether they realize it at the time or not. Like I said in one of my original posts on this thread, just because a woman feels sexy and appreciated right now doesn't mean she actually is being appreciated in a healthy way, and there is long term damage that can be done, whether she can see that at the time or not.

A better example, to me, would be drugs. Some people think they feel totally great doing drugs, so what's the problem? But that doesn't mean they aren't experiencing lasting physical damage under the surface. I'm sure there is lasting psychological damage occurring in most of those women, whether they recognize it or not.

To me, you guys saying that I can't say that degradation and objectification is objective, and it's just in the eye of the beholder, is as crazy as if you said that drugs being bad for you is in the eye of the beholder. That's clearly not true. Damage is being done, whether the beholder sees it happening or not. I mean how many of us, here, thought porn was perfectly harmless, and then after years of using porn discovered "oh hey, this stuff is actually really effing me up, and I never realized it." It seems completely ignorant, to me, for you not to recognize that the same could happen for women in a field like pornography or playboy.

Fine, fair enough. But I used your own comparison above, and my point still stands.

 

They don't spread their legs in the magazines but they're still whores by definition. Playboy whores don't have that nice ring to it so they call them bunnies. They live in a haram and bang an old dude in exchange for room and board. Theyre responsible for playing volleyball and washing cars with their tits hanging out. Come on man. You dont think thats degrading?

 

To be clear, to SuperFans point, as a woman, I can TOTALLY see how that kind of life could feel really exciting and nice, flattering even, and not feel degrading at all. So I don't deny that most of those women don't feel like trapped victims. But like I've said many times, just because you don't feel degraded and objectified doesn't mean you aren't, and it doesn't take away all of the lasting damage that can do to a woman.