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Masturbation Monagamy and other thoughts

Discussion in 'Rebooting - Porn Addiction Recovery' started by FernandoVenezuela, Aug 2, 2018.

  1. FernandoVenezuela

    FernandoVenezuela New Fapstronaut

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    So I've been following this community for a VERY long time. Since it first appeared on the cultural radar back in 2013 or so (?). I've been a participant, advocate, critic, sceptic, all of the above. Wanted to share some ideas.

    I'm wondering if the reason many of us fail to abstain from porn and masturbation - either separately or together - is because were not supposed to. It's the same reason abstinence training in high school is less effective than birth control and sex Ed in eliminating teen pregnancy. Young people are programmed for sex.

    Not saying I disagree with the destructive nature of porn etc - or the (supposed and maybe exaggerated) god-like powers abstaining gives you...

    What I'm saying is: men are sperm factories. Whatever the religious, moral, or other psychological/performance drawbacks of masturbation and porn - the reality is, we have been imbued by nature to want to have sex - basically all the time. There's no argument about that. It's a biological fact. Any denial of it is a fundamental denial of REALITY. This is likely why 99% of "reboots" end in failure after say...a week? More? Less? (We should start a separate data project to see how successful our membership is - by the numbers. I'm sure they are quite dismal).

    Now how we choose to deal with and accept the reality of our internal sperm factory - is completely up to us - and I understand that part. And I'm familiar with the debate surrounding this.

    The way I see it this argument is broken down into three questions:

    Is all sex bad?

    Is all masturbation bad?

    Is all masturbation to porn bad?

    My IT bros will probably love this post because honestly I'm thinking of this "problem" in traditional binary logic. I think we can solve this debate right now by answering a few of these questions.

    If we agree that sex w/partner = good (assuming it adheres to "normal" guidelines for healthy sex)

    And masturbation= wrong (in every sense - even without porn)

    And porn = always wrong (even when the performers are clothed, or the porn we're referring to is something suitable for work like sports illustrated swimsuit edition, or racy advertising etc)

    Then it breaks down like this:

    Daily sex with girlfriend = healthy, good

    Daily masturbation w/out porn= unhealthy

    Daily masturbation to porn= unhealthy

    If the community agrees to the above logic then a few problems exist. What if your girlfriend or partner travels a lot? The urge is still there but your girlfriend isn't. What if you don't have a girl friend? I have one but many members do not (no shame in it - no judgement). What if your partner's libido is lower than yours? Is cheating with another sexual partner a better option than porn? This was the crisis faced by men pre - 1950's when little to no pornography existed. Prostitution was a kind of institution. Is that better than porn?

    What about having ongoing sexual relationships with many different women simultaneously? Before I settled down four years ago - this was my situation. It certainly didn't FEEL more authentic or intimate than porn (but the hi fives did - ayooo).

    Here's my perspective. Monogamy, prostitution, porn, polygamy - All of these behaviors are trying to solve the same problem - the Darwinian sperm factory. The argument of this community is that the most common solution - or at least one of the most common of our time - internet pornography - is unhealthy - destructive to both yourself and society. The argument stems from the fact that the internet's variety creates unhealthy spikes in dopamine that ruins men similar to drug addiction.

    The solution - abstinence - is what is proposed.

    I've been okay with the logic so far - but the problem I have is with the solution. Abstinence has been tried by so many different groups and it has failed Everytime. Whether in teen sex education or with Catholic priests (what about prison?). It's success rate is pretty close to zero. I think it might be time to acknowledge that.

    We need a consensus on whether all porn is bad, all masturbation is bad, or only together? If you can abstain completely from porn - in all it's forms- while still masturbating - is that a success? What if you only masturbate to one porn actress per month (or per year) does that eliminate the "variety dopamine spike" that causes the dreaded (and maybe not real) "porn brain"? Would a kind of pornographic monogamy complement our real Monagamy? Or if you're one of the many single guys on here, would it eleminate the social awkwardness that this community blames porn for giving single guys? If we eleminate the mechanism for what makes porn bad, is it still bad ?

    I think these are questions that have to be answered. The one thing I think we have to acknowledge is that abstinence is not very successful - or a very realistic solution. It might be the most ideal solution - but there can be no debate that it is the least effective.

    I admire the people in this community. I think NoFap was a good first step. A call to arms against one of our modern world's more insidious evils. Now we have to come up with a better solution, dig deep into the data, and make this thing truly sustainable with solutions based more in science than in myth.

    Thanks for reading!
     
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  2. slink123456

    slink123456 Fapstronaut

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    A lot of questions! IMO, it varies massively from person to person and down to the preference of the individual.

    I would however, still say that all porn is bad, purely for what it does to the brain when the brain wants ‘more’. People who view porn for a number of years bump into sites or content which either severely affects them or should not be online. Some people never get over this anxiety and in some cases it can be very severe and a lifelong struggle. Sometimes, it is not their fault :- some people here only viewed porn because they were abused by others themselves and it is their only coping mechanism.

    There are many other questions there which I don’t have time to answer, but I would still say that porn is bad. That however doesn’t necessarily mean a person is bad - most people here are good as they want to do something about their addiction and it is constructive.
     
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  3. Hugoalsace

    Hugoalsace Fapstronaut

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    Interesting stuff in your post. In my opinion, the real problem with porn now is the fact the internet provides an unending supply of free porn to suit any sexual desire. The fact you can watch for 5-6 hours in one session is the real problem and the huge variety of porn is what creates an addiction. When I was a teenager, I had to buy magazines to get off. In addition to the social awkwardness of buying one in a shop, it would also take just around 15 minutes to look through the mag and find the best image to finish the job. Now you can go on for hours, always searching for a better, more erotic, clip.
    It is this which has turned me into an addict and this which is ruining society. The one commodity we all have that is precious is our time yet I have wasted days, even weeks, watching porn when I could have been writing, reading or doing something more constructive.
    I agree that men will always have urges but these urges rarely turned into true addictions in the pre internet era
     
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