P.A.W.S. - what are they, cure, duration

Hey guys.

I believe that PAWS itself can cause additional natural sadness or depression. Do you know what I mean? We have all the symptoms like brain fog, low energy, anhedonia, etc. That alone is a huge burden that we have. And of course it puts a strain on us. This itself leads to us feeling even worse. And that's the case for me.

I live alone and I was alone all day today without any social contact. I was inside my apartment all day. I only had about a 2-minute conversation with my mother. Other than that, no social contact at all. It's been like this for the last 4 years. The last 4 years I have avoided social contact because of my symptoms, but now I really need the social contact. I need friends and family.

As I said, this happens to me a lot. If I don't have social contact for a long time and don't get attention, then something happens to me. I get very sad, angry, frustrated and pessimistic. Believe me. Before, it happened again that I felt a tightness in my chest. I felt like I wanted to cry but couldn't. I just wanted this bad feeling to go away.

We normal people absolutely need social contact and recognition. We want to be heard. We need love and compassion. Humans are social beings. That's why I wrote this before. I saw black.

After I wrote this, I immediately went out to the bus to go into the city. There were lots of empty seats on the bus and a 4-seater. In the 4-seater was an older lady around 50 years old. I just followed my instinct and sat opposite her instead of sitting on the single seat.

She then looked at me innocently several times and I looked at her too. We didn't speak, but the tightness in my chest went away immediately and I felt much better. That alone was enough. We normal people are like that. We need this social contact, as I said before. No matter how tough you are, you will break without social contact. That's why I don't think it makes sense to put criminals in solitary confinement where they are alone in a cell for 23 hours a day, for example. I recently saw a documentary on YouTube about solitary confinement and these people deliberately started cutting and injuring themselves just to get social contact or attention.

In general, I would like to mention that my vision is more vivid again today. Everything looks nicer and better. Women are pretty, sweet, cute. I just love them in general.

There was another woman about 30 years old on the bus. She was about 4 meters away from me. We were sitting opposite each other. I think they call it pheromones. Somehow I found her attractive and I think she found me attractive too. I had a natural instinct to keep looking in her direction and I think she had these pheromones too. I have no idea if that's true, but I think so. I got an erection. I think we matched without even talking to each other. It was just a natural instinct that one day I would like to have her as my wife. I had natural instincts that I should go to her and talk to her. But I didn't do it because none of this is really developed in me yet, so I don't really have the benefits yet. These are just small signs that the benefits could come soon.

Then I just got off the bus and very strange things happened. I got some natural instincts that I should walk in this direction, then suddenly an instinct that I should look to the right, then suddenly an instinct that I should turn around and walk in the other direction. Imagine that. You're running straight and then you have like an instinct to turn around and run in the other direction. Then you run 20 meters and have the instinct to turn around and run in the other direction again. I stopped following those instincts because I still have social anxiety and I thought to myself, what do people think? I have no idea what that is.

I generally feel pheromones or instincts about which women I should approach and which women I should look at. I pretty much only look at faces and no longer at breasts and buttocks. I also have the feeling that these women are interested in me.

And I have instincts/feelings/pheromones, I don't know what you want to call it, that I know exactly which people are afraid of me looking at them. They avoid eye contact.

I was outside a grocery store and sat down on a bench and just watched the people. There was a lot going on. A lot of people. And social anxiety was significantly reduced and it felt more vivid. It's not yet as it should be, but I have the feeling that I could get out of the flatline this year.

After about 45 minutes I went into the store and bought something. Then there were several self-checkouts and an employee who stood there and handed out plastic bags and helped people with the self-checkouts. The plastic bags were behind her and I needed a plastic bag for my goods. I then turned around and saw the plastic bags and when I turned around she was already looking at my face and I was staring at her too. Then I passed her and took the plastic bag with me. Of course this could all just be a “coincidence” and I could be imagining it. But something is different.

Even when I walked around the city a bit and saw some people my age, I felt a natural instinct to go up to them and make friends with them. I didn't do it, but it seems like these instincts lead me to exactly the right people for me.

These instincts aren't quite perfect yet, but it's a sign that the benefits could be coming soon.

In general I feel more like a real man. I think I could satisfy sexually every woman. I feel confident. I am still a virgin and have no sexual experience with women at all. I never had a girlfriend or wife.

I've had all of this for a few days since my last PAWS reduction 18 days ago. However, I had 3 wet dreams and these wet dreams had fatal effects on me.

I'm back home now and now I'm thinking again that I could be cured this year, but then when I don't have social contact I fall into a deep hole and get chest pains. Then I think negatively and think that it will take me longer than 5 years etc.

How are you guys doing socially? Are you experiencing the same thing as me? I find it difficult to maintain social contacts because I always think that I am not good enough with my symptoms.

Enjoy your evening.

 

Not getting attention can destroy a person. That's why it's important, for example, to talk to someone. It is important to be praised. It is important that you experience appreciation. Affection and care is important.

My parents never gave me this when I was a child. They were too busy with work and their lives. I think that's why I developed such a love for women on screen. And I think that's why my addiction got out of hand.

Many children who do not have love from their parents fall into alcohol, drugs, prostitutes or crime.

 

Since my Flatline and Anhedonia started, all i want is pure social isolation. With no conflict or repressed emotions. People s presence just annoy me, people with good or bad intentions. It doesnt matter. It is just noise to me.

This is why i can say, in my case, there is only one " benefit " from PAWS, i lost the ability to feel lonely.

 

I see another case like mine. Flatline for years before even starting nofap,he was addicted to extreme porn and fapped for years, with no libido. Search: i'm the worst case on internet 90 days recovery. And even him has no anedonhia or anxiety. I think anedonhia and anxiety in this type of nofap Paws are related directly with libido loss. If you have a 90 years old cock 24 hours/24 how can you enjoy life? But, you can still feel emotions and happiness in some moment when you talk with other people. Logically if like someone here, you are isolated 24/24 social anxiety is a thing. But it's not related to PMO Paws. I have no social anxiety, i'm only depressed to my cock conditions. Anyway i want to cure it permanently . I hope you read my post in the previous page of this topic. What do you think about my condition?

 

Day 151 in a row no sex no PMO
Flatline symptoms are pronounced today, sleeplessness, anhedonia, depression,

I am happy that no urges to act out. I am grateful to not be acting out

Thank God that I am free from the PMO today.

I'm going back to work tomorrow and that usually takes my mind off things. And I am attending a recovery meeting tonight. Glad to be sober today

 

they are from all different types of recovery timelines, but my main point was that they are used sometimes to help mitigate the symptoms of paws. If people in benzo recovery can take antidepressants and still recover then i see no reason why pmo paws would be any different. I just used the benzo forum as a reference because i was pretty surprised when i went through there myself, especially about how open they were in recommending antidepressants.

Keep in mind, you may not personally need any extra support and thats ok. I just dont like the idea of discouraging others to do the same. Antidepressants can be a tool just like anything else in recovery, but its still not going to do the work for you. You will still need to recover all the same.

 

That's how I felt most of the time and now I feel more of an urge to be social. It's still not the way it should be, but more than before.

It would do me good if I could tell someone about my everyday life, such as a psychologist. That's why I'm thinking about registering with a psychologist soon. It would be great to have a weekly appointment with a psychologist. That way you're motivated to keep going and you can get everything off your chest. The psychologist is objective and listens.

You have a fixed appointment with a psychologist every week. This can be very helpful.

How are you? What are your first thoughts? What do you feel? Can you describe it? Try to write your first thoughts right away without thinking too much. This is something I've been trying recently and it helps a lot. Even when I write an email or send a WhatsApp message, for example. Respond immediately. And don't read the message 2-3 times, unless it's something very important of course.

 

Define "more consistent".

What's your current streak?

 

More consistent because sometimes i see porn without cumming,something like 3-4 times a months. But this results in 1 wet dreams every week. So 2 years in this way, 4 wet dreams a month and a couple of intentional orgasm. Not a pure" hardmode". My streak is now 3 days,but i want at least make 90 days no cum,no fantasy,no more. I this don't cure me, i search some help.

 

Bro you can't watch porn in any form or amount, it's killing you and will keep you in this state forever. Whether you M or O to it is largely irrelevant.

 

honestly I'm also afraid of possible nerve damage because during my flatline before nofap some times my penis burned from masturbation and this can also cause hard flaccid. I hope it's not a mix of causes. But yes,you are right. Hard mode is hard mode. No porn,no edging,no orgasm,nothing.

 

I also have a nicotine addiction, I smoke electric cigarettes. It might interfere with dopamine receptors, but honestly now we enter in science speculation,brain chemistry is very complex and I'm not going to eliminate nicotine too.

 

At the peak of my PAWS symptoms I was going to work and almost breaking down daily. I would sit in meetings and fight back anything from random tears to overwhelming feelings of anger. I had no choice but to see a therapist. I told him about NoFap, PAWS and all the symptoms and he broke things down for me and explained why the symptoms were occurring and how to recover.

For me talking to a psychologist helped me understand what was happening and how to recover. If you feel that talking to someone could help I would go for it.

 

If you truly want to recover unfortunately you are going to have to give some of these things up or at the very least cut them down. The longer you smoke and PMO the longer your recovery is going to be.

 

Very well said, and thanks for being so open about what you've been experiencing. Your honesty is, undoubtedly, helping others.

I feel for you, too. I've been experiencing THE EXACT SAME THING the past couple of months. I'll start thinking that my symptoms are as bad as ever, and then I'll go outside and drive. Most of the time I go to the convenience store up the street, or the grocery store, or the pharmacy. Simple errands. Some days the socializing does nothing for me (on the bad days), but oftentimes I start to feel much, much better, even after simple interactions with store clerks and pharmacists. That's all it takes to get rid of some of the bad feelings.

I've also had a hard time maintaining a consistent work schedule, so I'm still dependent on outside sources. Mainly my parents, which is shameful, but I know that it's only because of PAWs. I have no doubts about my work ethic or desire to be independent. I've had to make peace with how much PAWs has sort of wrecked my life.

Anyways, my plan is to move to New York City once Spring arrives. I need to be around people. I need to be forced to interact more. I'm caught in an anti-social rut, and because I live in the suburbs of a Midwestern town my options are quite limited. I have a college friend there who I really enjoy talking to, and that alone is more than what I have going on right now. Family is okay, but I don't really get what I'm looking for when interacting with 3/4 of them. My little brother is the only one who isn't narcissistic, and he has a serious girlfriend and his own life. My other family members leave me feeling more alone than when I started, because they don't want what's best for me--they sort of like it when I'm down, even though I'm still grateful that they are helping me out in other ways. I've learned, during PAWs, that you can feel multiple things at once. I love them and appreciate the hell out of them, but I also know not to expect emotional gratification when interacting with them.

I hope I receive help when it comes to this New York plan, because I really want to be around people again. I'll have to have roommates, so no matter what I'll be around others.

The best times of my life have occurred when I was part of a tight knit group. I lived with 9 other guys in college and it was the best time of my life. Our house was shitty but no one cared, because we had each other. I spent a summer in Sydney, Australia my junior year and developed a solid group of friends who did everything together. Sort of like a sitcom friend group, filled with both boys and girls. It was so fucking great. I never felt alone.

The last time I had this communal feeling was when I went away to a farm due to how fucked up I was. At the time I didn't know about PAWs, so me and my family assumed it was some devastating mental illness. Even though the other people there were broken, I was part of something bigger, and it didn't even matter that some of the folks were hard to talk with. It was about community. We were all in it together.

My goal is to find another community. And a significant other who shares the same interests. I know New York is full of strangers, but I think the sheer fact that I'll be out in a city all of the time will help me feel better.

I'm just tired of the same old life. I'm sick of waiting around. I know I'll still have days where everything will be awful, but I hope that it'll be worth it.

For the first time in my reboot, I believe that I can take action and perhaps alleviate symptoms through decision making. I've been only a victim of PAWs for 4.3 years, and it's time to start trying to take back some control. I hope the plan works out. I really, really do. If anything, I'll come back with new experiences and perspective.

 

Could you share some wisdom on how to deal with the PAWS? Are there any good resources to peruse online?

 

Day 152 in a row, no sex, no PMO
Flatline/PAWS is subdued today. I was distracted by work. Feeling hopeful and looking forward towards the future.

Last night before sleep I could feel some movement and blood flow "down there". It feels like I am very slowly getting back to normal.

I am happy that I don't have urges to act out. I am grateful to not be acting out today.

The past two weeks I have been eating healthy and taking a variety of vitamins and supplements daily. I am not sure how much the supplements help with the recovery process but they probably won't hurt.

Last night I went to a 12 step meeting and shared about PAWS and recovery. It helps to talk to others.

 

The image below should hopefully help explain PAWS and recovery as I was told by the psychologist.

The way I understand PAWS is that the nervous system is recovering from being heavily overstimulated for too long.

What I didn't understand at the time is that not everybody's nervous system is the same. Some people have a very sensitive nervous system, while others have a stronger or more insensitive one. One person might PMO for 20 years and be fine, while another might PMO for 7 years and gradually find himself in PAWS. What decides the condition of a persons nervous system can be anything from childhood experiences, trauma, stress, substance abuse or just genetics.

The key point for understanding recovery is that the nervous system has three modes of functioning:

• Safety (or Rest)
• Hyperarousal (or Fight/Flight)
• Hypoarousal (Freeze)

*Notice that the graph displays that SEXUAL RESPONSES decrease while in FREEZE/RED which is PAWS

In short, to recover from PAWS, our nervous system needs time to move from Hypoarousal (FREEZE), back to Safety (REST). To do this it helps to identify what has put your nervous system into FREEZE in the first place. Avoiding high stimulation activities whether it be PMO, Stress or Substance abuse will allow the nervous system to eventually move back to SAFETY or homeostasis. Again the wrong stimulation keeps the nervous system in FREEZE or FIGHT-FLIGHT and lengthens the process.

During therapy the psychologists highlighted the other issue with PAWS recovery:

Example
Say I am 13. I meet a girl I really like and decide to ask her out. When I finally pluck up the courage to speak to her, not only does she reject me, she laughs in my face in front of her friends. I spend the next few years avoiding girls and keep to myself. At 16 I finally meet a girl I like who feels the same way. We start dating and things are going great. It finally comes time to have sex and I am so nervous that the whole ordeal ends up going terribly. Afterwards we gradually grow apart and she dumps me. Years of these feelings condition my nervous system so that whenever females/intimacy/sex comes up, my nervous system automatically shifts into FIGHT-FLIGHT out of fear.

What was explained is that stimulation doesn't just have to be PMO, alcohol and social media. It can be consistent worrying, anger and fear. He explained a childhood full of worry, fear and anxiety will condition your nervous system to react unreasonably once you become an adult. Obviously this is not the case for everybody, but he highlighted taking the time to consider why your nervous system is so sensitive. It could just be genetic and not an emotional/stressful/traumatic response for some people.

The final point he raised is that some of the symptoms we experience from PAWS, is actually the body adapting to survival. When the body goes into FREEZE (or PAWS) it is because it essentially believes we are in danger. Think back to the 16 year old boy constantly fearing intimacy, putting himself into FIGHT-FLIGHT. Throw in consistent PMO and a bit of stress and eventually the body will have no choice but to go into FREEZE. Once in FREEZE it initiates any of the following body functions as a means of survival:

• Immobilisation: the nervous system believes we are in danger and so what is known as muscle immobilisation kicks in. Immobilisation creates muscle tension and stiffness throughout the body as means to keep it still for survival.
• Social Withdrawal: it will emotionally disconnect us or numb us from our feelings (through dissociation/anhedonia) so we stand a better chance at survival.
• Eye Contact: direct eye contact (in regards to survival) is symbolised as confrontational, and so while in PAWS the body forces us to avoid contact as a means of avoiding shame and/or judgement.
• Sexual Response: while in FREEZE the nervous system heavily decreases all our sexual responses (libido, erection etc) as means of conserving resources for recovery.

Sorry that this is such a long post. PAWS is essentially a state that the nervous system gets stuck in due to the condition of our nervous system. To escape FREEZE it means addressing the underlying causes of being stuck in FREEZE (or PAWS) which most of as already know. Hope this helps in some kind of way, i'll try and dig out mores resources and post separately.