Women tempting intentionally

Lol I've never looked in the mirror and thought "damn girl", I wear literally whatever's comfortable to me or if there's a style I like regardless of what others think.

Obviously I don't dress like a slag or purposely show anything off, but if say a dress or jeans happen to show off my "assets" more or whatever then so be it, I don't dress for others and only for myself.

 

I wasnt trying to be confrontational. I'm just talking.

Yes... me too. Lol

I dont think I ever said "usually." If I did, I misspoke. I'm not trying to say that most women who dress provocatively are just ignorant. I'm just saying that a lot of them are, so I would prefer to give someone the benefit of the doubt before just assuming they have nefarious intentions, like a lot of people (not necessarily you, but a lot of men here) seem to do.

Perhaps, but I dont think it's as rare as you think it is. I've had this conversation with a lot of women, and it doesnt seem to be a very rare thing, in my experience. My best friend, for example, hates it when people look at her and hit on her, it makes her annoyed and she things its gross or rude. But she dresses fairly provocatively all the time, and genuinely doesnt see how that makes more people look at her and hit on her. I know that's just one example, but in my experience it isn't an uncommon one.

I guess we just have to agree to disagree, because as I've said, that is SO not my experience of almost every female friend I have. This was genuinely a "whaaaat??" moment for me when I heard that men were enticed by yoga pants, and I asked around any everyone else had the sake reaction. Like "what? Why? They're just comfy pants, they're not sexy at all...." It was widespread, genuine confusion. So I dont know if I can say that "most women" notice how yoga pants make their butt look when almost everyone I know, myself included, had no clue.

I can sort of see it, now, but honestly, I still dont think about it that way when I wear them. I have pretty much never looked at my butt in yoga pants and though "damn, look at that ass." I've thought that plenty of times about my boobs in certain shirts, or even my butt in other like work-out type pants or tight dresses, but never with yoga pants. I just dont really see it.

Well the last half of that sentence is where what we are taking about shifts into two different things. I'm not talking about someone making a "conscious decision" to wear clothes that show off their physical features. If someone puts on yoga pants because they're comfy, is that really making a conscious decision to wear something that shows off their features? I dont think it is. It's not conscious if all they're thinking is "these pants and comfy and I just wanna be comfy today."

Because it's what you happen to have in your closet? I dont really understand this question. Yoga pants are extremely comfortable. Yes, they also happen to make your butt look good if you have a nice butt, but why does that mean that you are automatically wearing them for that reason? My yoga pants are infinitely more comfortable than my baggy sweatpants, especially if its warm outside. So what, are women supposed to consciously choose things that dont look good in order to not be judged as wanting attention? I just dont see what you're getting at here. I wear my yoga pants around the house all the time, even if I'm not going to see anyone. So... what's your point? If I'm just lounging around the house, I still would wear that thing that happens to make my butt look good. I'm not going to wear a lowcut, tight dress and heels around the house. but yoga pants? Absolutely.

I also often wear them to the movies, because honestly my priority at the movies is to be as cozy as possible, and sometimes sweat pants are just too hot for summer where I live. In that scenario, I'm spending most of my outing in a dark theater where nobody can see me. So I still dont really see the point you're trying to make, as it relates to yoga pants.

I know you might be thinking I'm too fixated on yoga pants, but it's because that's the kind of thing that becomes a bit of a blurry line. Obviously we can both agree that most women dont put on a full face of makeup and do their hair and wear heals and tube tops just for themselves. But yoga pants are a very popular thing that I've seen SO many men on here judging women for wearing or assuming they're all sluts or, worst yet, using that assumption to justify their own issues with lust or to justify harassing the girl because she must be asking for it.

Again, you seem to be completely missing the point. I am telling you right now that there are tons of women who genuinely have NO CLUE that yoga pants are sexually appealing. So no, I dont agree that they are expecting attention by wearing something that they dont even see as sexually appealing.

Yes, of course. I know you agree with me on that. Unfortunately a lot of people here probably dont, though they likely wouldn't admit that.

 

Me walking into this thread.

 

Perhaps I should clarify here: I enjoy a good debate, especially when i feel strongly about a subject and all parties in the discussion are civil and respectful and reasonably intelligent. So theres no hostility here on my end. I'm just enjoying the conversation. Sorry if it ever comes across that way. I'm kind of a blunt speaker when it comes to text, so sometimes I might sound more irritated than I am.

 

And there is nothing wrong with that. But you are the one who is actively making the choice to put on clothes. So you are also actively making the choice to put on clothes that will show off your "assets". If that kind of attention doesn't bother you, it's all good.

Even if you dress only for yourself, you are aware that the people around you are going to notice you. If the people around you are men, you are aware that the more attention you will draw to your assets, the more you're asking for that kind of attention.

 

I interpreted "well, that's nice for you if you can do that" as sarcasm. But maybe I mistunderstood then. I guess if we can both agree on neutrally exchanging different view points without being personal, we are on the same page.

I thought that was exactly what you were saying in your initial post:

I believe the whole thread is under the theme of women dressing intentionally to provoke men into giving them attention which I think I've made clear by now is a statement I, as a woman, fully support. But I don't think anybody (at least in this thread) said that such provocation is done out of evil intentions. Unless I missed something or someone's post.

As you acknowledge yourself, this is an impossible argument to conclude because we would have to ask every single female on the planet if she is aware of the clothes she is wearing. Like I said, obviously if this was the case with you and your yoga pants and the same with your friends, it's something that happens. But based on my 25 years of life experience I can say that self-awareness and awareness of the people around us is simply part of human nature, male or female. If you are not aware that when you put on a piece of clothing that it is skin tight and wearing almost like a second skin, okay. If you look at the mirror and don't notice that what you're wearing is heavily accentuating your ass, doubtful, but okay. But at latest when you go out on the street and notice the attention you'll get, that's when you will notice.

See my previous post, yes, it is. You are deceiving yourself and/or others if you think you are not making a conscious decision when you yourself take your clothes and put them on to go outside. You put on something that makes you feel comfy with yourself, understood, but you will also be aware that you have other people's eyes on you and you yourself are determining what kind of eyes by the type of clothes you're wearing.

You don't seem to be consistent in your argumentation which is a bit confusing. First you were talking about any kind of provocative clothing, now you're just fixating on the yoga pants. Either way, you are indeed trying to make an argument by narrowing everything down to your own experiences. I think it's really not that hard to acknowledge the fact that at some point during puberty, any female will become aware of the fact that men are naturally instinctively drawn to the female shape. If you put on clothes that will show off your sexual features, you are consciously putting on clothes that will you give you attention based on your sexual value.

That might be true, but I don't think this particular thread was implying such a thing, unless I really missed something.

 

A woman can wear anything and still get leered at or "entice" men, essentially I may as well wear a bloody potato sack because God forbid I was born with bigger assets and no matter what I wear it's a no no. Nice try but you obviously don't know me, not once have I put on something for the sake of attention like you distastefully claim.

That's why I say I don't go out of my way to be sexual, but considering my body shape it's almost impossible even with just simply jeans and a t-shirt. Honestly I'm not going to dedicate my time and life trying to figure out what does and doesn't trigger folks when it's simply my choice, and I'm not even doing it on purpose.

Spoiler: A new Era of female "safe" clothes!

 

Never did I claim anywhere that any woman can stop any man from giving her attention based on her sexual appeal by simply being a woman, no matter what she is wearing. But if a woman is wearing sexually provocative clothing, she is intentionally provoking that kind of attention. That is the whole point I'm trying to make here.

I haven't made a single distasteful claim about you, as you acknowledge yourself, I don't know you. Please don't put words into my mouth. It was your very own words that you acknowledge you will choose to wear clothes that happen to show off your assets if they are comfortable to wear. Just because you naturally have more noticeable assets regardless of the type of clothes you're wearing, doesn't mean that if you choose to put on clothes that are not provocative (like jeans and a T-shirt) you are intentionally asking to draw attention to your assets.

 

That would probably trigger some guy as well... At the end of the day you can wear anything and you'll trigger someone. It down to the individual to find a way to cope with triggers.

Excellent post there @SanSolo. I sometimes see women out wearing short skirts and they trying to pull the skirt down and of course, a man may wonder why she would wear something like that if wanted it to be longer but I think not a lot of thought goes into it. But I think many don't think it through. I would constantly ask my ex why she wore the clothes she was wearing and she always would say she didn't know. In the end, she got so fed up with me always asking her and told that she never thinks before she puts clothes, she just puts them on. I think when it comes to special occasions there might be some thought but not day to day. Some of us may check what we look like in the mirror but we don't ask ourselves why we're wearing it.

 

sometimes we are not aware what can trigger someone else.......but off course everyone loves attention(most of them)
be it a male or a female
why people buy expensive clothes........to look good
why people do excercise.........to be fit and to look good
but that does not mean they are demanding ogling.......in india there have been many case..........where girls are fully covered without any "provocation" but still they get molested..........reason is the poison in the mind of molester....
this reminded me a video in which some girls were claiming that they like when guys fold thier sleeves up.......they find it hot
now this is strange for me......this proves sometimes we are unaware that we are tempting someone

 

I guess I'll have to disagree with the point you're trying to make. If you're trying to say that just because a woman wears 'sexually provocative clothing,' she is seeking that attention, then that's wrong. Yes, of course, if she is making a conscious decision to attract unhealthy attention on herself, then something isn't right. But if a woman feels comfortable wearing something, and it happens to come under the broad spectrum of 'sexually provocative clothing,' I don't see anything wrong with it. That's her choice; it doesn't mean she wants that unwanted attention.

@Wave Surfer pointed out that it's up to the the individual who is triggered to find a way to deal with that trigger. That's the individual's problem, not the source of the trigger, right? As PAs, we need to learn to cope with whatever this pornified society has come to, accept it as the unfortunate reality; blaming others for our own problems isn't going to solve them. The repercussions of this addiction will persist, and it's up to us to manage them.

 

I still stand by and agree with all of those quotes. I choose my words carefully. I never said the word "usually" and the only time I said "most people" is when I said that most people dont really sexualize their own bodies, which idk, maybe "most" is inaccurate, but honestly I think that's true for the most part. At the very least, plenty of women (which is the terminology I've been using and stand by) dont sexualize themselves I. that way in their own mind. I'm not saying g they can't, or that they never do, I'm just saying that that switch isn't "on" 24/7. So if someone is not really thinking about trying to entice men or look sexy that day it seems perfectly reasonable to assume they might unintentionally wear something enticing without "inviting that kind of attention." Because they're not thinking about their bodies that way all the time. Most of the time, people are just living their lives and thinking about themselves. They're not constantly aware of what everyone else around them is thinking and feeling about what they're wearing. And not to sound all "feministy" but it's really rather annoying that this is even a conversation, because do men ever have to deal with this? Do men deal with people assuming that any time they wear something attractive or flattering, they're just begging to be lusted after or harassed or hit on? Of course not. They just assume that they liked that shirt, or its comfortable, or whatever.

I never said "evil intentions" either.... But to say that women dress for sexual attention, in my opinion, is assuming something a bit negative about that person. Because people who dress for sexual attention all the time likely aren't very aware of how that might negatively effect the men around them, which in my opinion is not very kind, and they also are often riddled with self esteem issues if they need constant validation from strangers regarding their looks. Either that or they are arrogant. There are a lot of negative characteristics associated with someone dressing for attention, so no it's not "evil intentions," but it does imply something negative.

The issue I have is that you've never had this specific conversation with any of the women around you. Well, except right now, and you have several women telling you that its not uncommon for people to not think about that stuff when getting dressed in the morning, but you still hold firm to your assumption that everyone is good at self awareness at every second of the day. I've met TONS of people who have absolutely terrible self awareness, or who simply dont care enough about other people to think about how their actions might effect them. Its incredibly common, in my experience, and I find it strange that that's not common in your experience. Do you really think people go around constantly thinking about how they're effecting other people all the time? I think most people are thinking about themselves like 80% of the time, and that very well could include the time in which they're getting dressed that morning.

Also, to be fair, I'm not even saying that people who wear, for instance, yoga pants dont care at all or haven't thought at all about how they look. Sometimes I wear yoga pants with a cute top, and do my hair and makeup. Clearly I care, then, about how i look. But that doesnt mean that I've looked in the mirror and said "damn, look at that ass! I'm gonna get so much attention and men are going to be staring at me all day!" Theres obviously a middle ground between not caring at all about what anyone thinks of what you look like, and dressing intentionally for attention (particularly attention from men). And that's what bugs me about your view, is that you seem to be completely ignoring that middle ground as if it doesnt exist. And I think that middle ground is where most people live, most of the time.

Yet again, you're just completely ignoring and dismissing truth. You can call me a liar or call my friends and mom and sister and other liars all you want, but you're just wrong. I'm sorry, on that point, you are just wrong. People can TOTALLY wear stuff like that and not realize. It happens all the time. I've seen it happen time and time and time again, from people who very much care about modesty and would not intentionally be wearing something immodest. I've seen people have to tell others "um, hey, so... your shirt is really see-through and it's a bit inappropriate for church" and the person is absolutely mortified because they had no clue. It happens all the time. Especially when it comes to yoga pants. I had NEVER in my life thought of yoga pants as some "skin tight, extra skin" kind of clothing. Ever. And I'm actually a pretty self-aware person. So i can only imagine that people less self aware than me might not notice it either.

I've literally never gotten "attention" from wearing yoga pants before. Ever in my life. And I've worn them a lot, and have a pretty bangin body, if I do say so myself. I'm also really bad at noticing when people are checking me out. When I go out with my mom or sister, they'll point it out to me when people are checking me out and I usually have no clue. So again, I feel like you're just assuming something negative about people rather than giving them the benefit of the doubt.

Okay, I think I'm pretty much done with this conversation now. This is officially ridiculous. I think it's rather ridiculous to assume everyone puts that much thought into their clothing and how it effects others. Again... you're assuming a whole lot of things here that are just simply not true in a lot of situations. And it sort of also screams of blaming women for guys leering at them. And to be clear, I'm not talking about girls walking around with their boobs out and a mini skirt and crop top or something. I'm talking about an average chick wearing comfy pants.

When was I talking about any kind of provocative clothing?

No, I'm not doing that at all. In fact, I feel like YOU are doing that. You're assuming that because you have self awareness and apparently put a ton of thought into how you dress every day, that everybody else is exactly the same. I'm doing ththe opposite of that. I'm recognizing that everybody is NOT exactly like me, and therefore I can't judge their intentions without knowing a lot more about them as a person. I'm only using my experiences (and by the way, also the experiences of tons of other women... its not like I'm the only one I'm talking about here) to show YOU that other people are different than you, and that maybe you should acknowledge that and give people the benefit of the doubt.

Yep. That's a true statement. I never disagreed with that. But that doesnt mean that we are all thinking about that every second of the day, or when we get dressed.

Not if you dont notice that they show off your sexual features. That's the entire point... I dont see what's so hard to understand about that.

Honestly this thread is kind of old and I dont remember how it began, so i might be mixing it up with a different thread.

 

Seriously same, girl. I remember once when I was about 16 or 17, I was walking out of a store with my mom, wearing regular flare jeans and a shirt that didn't even show any cleavage at all, and some guy walked by me and said "I like your boobs." I certainly was not "asking for that kind of attention."

 

No! You are assuming intent! That's the problem!

You're assuming that because something appears provocative to YOU, that's how it appears to everyone else as well, and the woman wearing it knew that when she put it on. And you say I'm the one viewing everything strictly from my own experience. Far from it.

 

Yes, exactly! Great example. This is exactly how I felt about yoga pants.

 

Here let me bring up your quote:

So if you actually read what was written I said if what I'm wearing happened to show off more of my body in some way or trigger people then so be it, that doesn't mean I actively go about it on purpose or even notice at all. I find it funny you claim I'm putting words in your mouth when that's exactly what you just did to me.

 

Lol, It's completely knackering finding clothes for me to be honest and I kinda got to a point where I stopped caring to an extent. I can wear literally anything and I'll get stared at for obvious reasons, and while I do like my body sometimes it feels like a down right curse in that area. I totally blame me mum for that.

Aww well, such is life I guess, if I enjoyed a lot of attention I guess it would my dream come true. lol I at least hope you have an easier time than I.

 

I swear google is making it much more difficult to post gifs, you search google images then you try and copy that link but it takes you to another page, this is embarrassing as I consider myself quite technical.

 

They already have burkas in the middle east

 

@lolwut so that is why you choose to wear yoga pants when you're doing zumba with me, I knew something was not right there. . . and the need to carry baby oil in your backpack, how the hell do you explain that?!