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This "loneliness" sub-forum is Toxic.

Discussion in 'Loneliness' started by Phenom1415, Dec 11, 2016.

  1. Phenom1415

    Phenom1415 Fapstronaut

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    Hello, now it is not my wish to offend anybody.

    First to quickly say about myself that I'm on day 26 of Nofap and I have felt great, however yesterday I came across these articles online talking about the younger generation not having as much s*x as older ones and I spent a while reading these articles, after a while it got me down a bit thinking about my own situation of not having anyone.
    After that I came here too becausei remember this sub forum from the past and after reading people constantly talk about being lonely I feel even worse about myself.

    The point I wish to get across is that this constant talk of loneliness will only reenforce the sadness every time you come here to talk about it. I feel like the best way to handle these situations are either to go out there and meet someone or simply focus on other things in life.

    The only threads I've read here which I do feel to be ok is those of wives and husbands who feel hurt because of what pmo has done to their relationship.

    But all this negativity ("I don't have a gf" "I'm a virgin" "I'm lonely") will only make you feel worse as time goes on. I once read a study which said that girls who use social media feel mkre depression since they are constantly discussing there problems with their friends which thus only makes it worse.

    This was not to offend or shame anyone, I don't see anyone here as "losers" or any of that other labeling nonsense. I just want to say that constant negativity and dwelling on problems while taking no action in the real world only makes this worse.

    Hope this wasn't too long. Thank you for reading.
     
    Deleted Account, Hiraeth, JW4 and 6 others like this.
  2. Phenom1415

    Phenom1415 Fapstronaut

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    Something else I found after I wrote the previous post which i think is worth a little read:

    http://www.nbcnews.com/id/20185446/.../quit-complaining-it-may-make-you-feel-worse/

    If watching porn reinforces those neural pathways which make you want to watch it again then it's not too far a stretch to say that constantly complaining about a problem makes it worse and reinforces those pathways which make you wanna complain again : People become addicted to complaining and reinforcing these negative feelings.
     
    waterworld and Power of the Mind like this.
  3. Tesslynne

    Tesslynne Guest

    Well, it's helpful to ME to read what you said, cos I really want another boyfriend (been nearly 4 years) and I KNOW I complain too much about not having one. And I need to STOP doing that and stop complaining about how online dating guys only want sex from me. Or saying I am too old for love & the kind of guy I like will never want ME.
    Cos I'm not gonna speak for others but me yeah I think I can relate to what you are saying in that I think I talk about both those issues too much and probably DO make it feel worse for myself. Initially it feels good to share but it probably ends up being a negative thing. I like how you brough the neural pathways in. Anyway, hmmm something to THINK about! So I need to stop. It probably DOES feed it all.
     
    HopefulJ16 likes this.
  4. Pursuit__Of__Happiness

    Pursuit__Of__Happiness Fapstronaut

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    There is some degree of truth in what you are saying, but this isn't the complete picture either. Life is not always black & white, rather it contains mostly shades of gray. Ya, crying, complaining about something can't be the solution, and it's a portrayal of a victim mindset. But, having said that, we also need to consider, sometimes, all that we can do is to seek the help of others. That can be a great step for a lot of us. Many people remain stressed, depressed about something, but they don't let the outer world know about it, and some go the extent of ending their lives, unfortunately, when possibly there could have been a solution for their problems. So, it's not always bad to share your feelings and seeking help, rather it's a very bold and courageous step for a lot, who either are unaware of their problem or ignore or hide it from the rest of the world or simply are not capable of finding the solution themselves. So, we should rather encourage people to speak their heart and share their feelings, emotions. Then only, they will be able to truly connect to their real selves. But, yes even after understanding the issue, the solutions, the way they can change their lives, if somebody repeats the mistake or only complains about something and takes no action to improve his/her life, then that may not be good. But, that is a difficult trade off to decide for us.
     
    Last edited: Dec 11, 2016
  5. SnowWhite

    SnowWhite Fapstronaut

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    Regarding social media: I had long the feeling that facebook canmake you more lonely then you already are.
    You only feel connected, but in fact you are lonely.

    If at all, then use social media as a communication channel, in order to meet people in reality.
     
    Thomas Vanhaecht likes this.
  6. NFjourney2016

    NFjourney2016 Fapstronaut

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    There is truth to this.

    Well see, there is fine line between talking about something to get it off your chest and talking about something and reinforcing it.

    Some know that line and adhere to it. Knowing people are out there going through the same thing helps them. But at the same time, some people may come here too much and end up feeling low.

    Its a perfect example of "Anything consumed alot is harmful"
    This forum is one of them.
    So are some NF groups. The amount of sex talk just makes go nuts.

    I used to come here ALOT and then realized I feel much better when Im not here.

    Thanks to your post, Im going to make my way into other fun things than read these threads and get sad :)
     
  7. SyrusDrake

    SyrusDrake Fapstronaut

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    I think this is an oversimplification.
    I see where you're coming from, the idea that such a place could reinforce negative emotions does make sense, to a degree. But on the other hand, there's more to this. I am an eternal virgin and #ForeverAlone too. And when you complain about being a mid-20s virgin or about something along those lines, you either get told to not worry about it (usually by people who aren't and have never been in your situation) or you get yelled at and told that you're an asshole because you feel "entitled" to sex, even though you never expressed such sentiments.
    It's only in places like this where you can express your crushing sadness and have people say "Yea, I know how you feel. It really sucks."

    tldr: Other places offer platitudes or hate when you express your sadness. Places like this express compassion. And that's very important.
     
    Deleted Account and DayOne44 like this.
  8. Many people find that sharing their pain and finding others that have the same issues to be very cathartic. I agree that there are some people that may find this forum depressing, but they should probably just stay away from it for their own good. It's definitely not for *everyone* but sometimes just having someone say "yeah I know how that feels" can really help brighten your day.
     
  9. Reading description of urges and triggers probably gets the reader triggered and craving with massive urges afterwards. But this is not what this section is about, its about offering help and support and technical information for day-to-day struggles with loneliness.

    okay maybe some posters dwell on the negative aspects and at some level just want attention, but everyone really just wants to talk and maybe get some help.

    I used this section before but i dont really look at it anymore, i kinda glossed through it now and i dont really want to read anything. yeah you're right wtf am i talking about
     
  10. Red Eagle

    Red Eagle Fapstronaut

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    I completely agree. This is the main reason I tend to avoid this section of the forum. It just pulls me down every time.
     
    Phenom1415 and Deleted Account like this.
  11. F50C137YZ

    F50C137YZ Fapstronaut

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    This is part of why I say my piece and then let it be for a while. You can obsess over making people feel better. The problem with that is that either the person is open to receiving help or not.

    If they aren't, there isn't all that much that you can do other than offer whatever wisdom that you can and hope that that come to a realization later.

    If they are, you may have just helped them realize something important.

    People are so obsessed with instant communication these days. We are all used to texting and the immediate response that tends to take place.

    Some forget that part of the beauty of forums is that it's not necessary to "stay on top" of the conversation. You have no obligation. If you feel like it's bringing you down, go do something to charge yourself up. If you find yourself constantly checking threads, remember, this isn't a chat room.
     
    Phenom1415 and Deleted Account like this.
  12. DayOne44

    DayOne44 Fapstronaut

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    Rarely am I on this "Loneliness" forum, although this is where I may belong more than anyplace else.

    Tonight, I swung over here after reading a string of posts in which a fellow fapstronaut was recounting his sexual encounters with various women and how he enacted them.

    His PMO habits were appropriately tied into his long chronicle.

    There is more than enough of that on NoFap at times, from both men and women.

    I came here to "Loneliness" to be grounded in a different, more sober reality.

    People on "Loneliness" do seem to feel sorry for themselves, and I admit that I've been feeling sorry for myself for years.

    Young men in their teens and twenties bemoan not yet having had girlfriends at their ages.

    Never having had a girlfriend is, believe me, much more distressing at age 44.

    The self-pity on this forum, however, does not bother me as much as reading posts from guys bragging about how NoFap has advanced their sexual conquests.

    Such stories can cause some people here frustration and deep feelings of inadequacy because NoFap does not hold out this promise to them.

    A girlfriend is not guaranteed to magically appear with a reboot, even though some guys report greater sexual success.

    You are not going to suddenly get laid on Day 91 after rebooting.

    One might say, "I should just go ahead and fap with porn the rest of my life because that's all I may ever have."

    Many of us have PMO problems for this reason; PMO has been our only viable sexual option.

    So, we do need this separate safe space of our own.

    Our struggle is doubly difficult because giving up PMO will be a life most likely without any kind of sexual experience.

    This is a higher road because the greater challenges for those in "Loneliness" require greater honestly and even higher ideals for our lives.
     
    Deleted Account likes this.
  13. Oliver123

    Oliver123 Fapstronaut

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    I hate seeing this loneliness sub-forum every time I come on here. It's hard enough to deal with loneliness as is. I come here for the community, the insight, not the self destructive thoughts of others. There are plenty of forums for romantic loneliness. This sub-forum takes away from the spirit of the whole.

    @DayOne44 I see your point and agree with a lot of it. I don't think anyone can truly fool themselves into thinking that just because they don't PMO for a certain amount of days in and of itself they'll get more real intimacy, without delusion of course. But addiction is addiction, and the effects of any and one like PMO are well documented, and anecdotally supported. So overcoming those things would help in all aspects of life.
     
  14. Kennen

    Kennen Fapstronaut

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    It's true.
    I maybe a hypocrite for agreeing with you :D AHAHAHA

    I sometimes rant post in other forum whenever I encounter toxic players in online games.
    Instead of being toxic in-chat/in-game, I rant post.
    It eases my feelings, plus, I want to avoid getting ban in-game. :p

    I think it's not always about seeking attention..
    We just need something to vent.
     
  15. SyrusDrake

    SyrusDrake Fapstronaut

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    It sure does for me. Those omnipresent stories of people becoming "sex gods" thanks to noFap have not only lured me in but also given me an entirely false impression of what it is about.

    Yup. And tbh, I still see PMO as the only way to express my sexuality.

    So I agree with you, this here is a necessary and important "safe space" for people like us...even though I hate the word.
     
    Deleted Account likes this.
  16. You just coined an incredible term, 'sex gods': Fapstronauts that supposedly have horrible intimacy issues or no sex drive and after they start NoFap they suddenly start consensual tapping of every person they see after just one or two social interactions. Supposedly.

    its something imaginary to strive for and clouds this challenge because its far from reality and sets our expectations of ourselves way too high.

    And this stuff makes the noFap challenge harder than it should be, instead of reaching this imaginary unreachable stage where we surpass porn addiction and stop fapping and forget we were ever addicted to porn we get stuck relapsing and stressing and feeling lonely and whining about every single thing and then we need a safe space, a place for people of similar circumstances to share our bad feelings with each other.

    I wrote this then realized my post didn't add anything to this discussion, am still confused as to what i wanted to say. Anyway loneliness section has negative and positive aspects.
     
    billiammn and DayOne44 like this.
  17. F50C137YZ

    F50C137YZ Fapstronaut

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    I've said something like this in another thread. People are at different places in their lives when they discover nofap. Some guys practice talking to girls/women a lot way before discovering nofap.

    Expecting to all of the sudden be a "sex god" after starting nofap is like expecting to be a "guitar god" after listening to Jimi Hendrix albums for three months straight.

    I agree, there are a large number of people that go on and on about "superpowers". It is what drew me in at first too. However, there is no denying the positive effects of Nofap if one actually applies one's self instead of sitting around feeling sorry for one's self and attempting to "not masturbate". Guess what? "Not fapping" is literally doing nothing and sitting around thinking about fapping.

    How successful is a heroin addict going to be at kicking heroin if they sit in their house with a bunch of needles full of heroin and they keep thinking "I won't shoot up today"? Probably not so much. In fact, thinking about "not shooting up" will probably make them think about shooting up.

    My point being that nofap is what you make it. We can't blame our lack of improvement on other people that rant and rave about all of the great stuff that they are doing. They were probably in a good place when they picked up nofap. So, they propelled themselves to an even better place. We all have to own our own experience, the good and the bad.

    I hate both sides: the people that set unrealistically high expectations for other people and the people that claim that all of it is bullshit when they don't instantly become a rockstar / cockstar. It's just like anything else, it's hard work. Nothing comes free and most things don't come easily.

    I empathize, I do. It's disappointing for people that have become addicted to making excuses and procrastinating. That's what it boils down to. Also, some people become addicted to being in misery and receiving pity. "Poor me!" and in return they want, "Oh poor you, I'm so sorry! Keep on doing what you're doing."

    There are those of us who call out the bull and say, "Hey, you might want to take a look into another perspective." Not because we're being dicks, but because we are sharing our own life experience. Then the poor me people come back with, "Oh, but, poor me! I don't want to have to see things differently! I want the world to change." Well, the world isn't going to change without interjection, dialectic and interaction. None of that includes complaining on a forum.

    Frankly, I'm fed up with the poor me crowd as well. Not because I don't feel for them, but because they are unwilling to see any other perspective other than "woe is me".

    This is not everyone in the loneliness section. I have seen plenty of threads where people are genuinely looking for help. What is frustrating is when people are looking for help and every single person that tries to help is shot down with one basic message. "I don't want to be helped. I'm just venting." Then don't ask for help!

    Venting is what journals are for. I think this is the direction that the OP intended. Not that the loneliness section is bullcrap, but that people are misusing it and never putting any effort into making an actual journal in the correct forum section.

    Btw, there is nothing wrong with feeling sorry for yourself. I've been through that, I think most of us have and will still have those days. I just believe that this section is really intended for people that want a need help in improving their situation.

    It's just silly to blow up the loneliness section with three or four threads only to keep firing back at everyone about how all advice is wrong. Btw, there is a difference between "eh, not for me thanks", then seeing someone else's post and taking some of their wisdom because they worded it better or it resonates with you more and "No. No. No. No. No. No."
     
  18. Lone_Wolf

    Lone_Wolf Fapstronaut

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    The only reason subforums like this continue to exist, in my estimation, is because the root causes never get addressed. Someone who is lonely talks about it and either gets a "there there" response or they get hectored at for not letting it go. Simply glossing over a problem has never solved a problem. I think that's the current trend today, actually. People are expected to never discuss their vulnerabilities, for if they do they can usually count on either a lecture or someone engaging in schadenfreude (especially online).
    In my opinion, this is why people never heal. This is why people just grin and carry open wounds. This is unhealthy.
    Just my two cents. Take it or leave it.
     
  19. I agree you should not try to overcome negativity by seeing more negativity this will only make it worse. What I would also recommend to all the people who say "I don't have a gf" "I'm a virgin" "I'm lonely" to make an appreciation list. There must be some things that you may have. If you always focus on the things you don't have then you will be unhappy. Focus on what you have instead.

    Good luck everyone!
    Thomas
     
    Deleted Account likes this.
  20. SyrusDrake

    SyrusDrake Fapstronaut

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    To be fair, I didn't really "coin" it. I first heard it in this video which I found via YBOP. But I think its use can be extended. Although, I have to admit, I much prefer @F50C137YZs "cockstar...

    Anyhow, I fully agree. I now see that noFap has its benefits but a good 90% of the benefits I was promised on reddit and all those other sources were massively exaggerated. And this is where arguments like this come in:
    Well...yea. I read that a lot. You need to make other improvements to your life too. But then it reminds me of those faux fitness products. "This product will make you lose 40 pounds in one month!" And then, in the fine print: "If you also exercise daily and limit your calorie intake to 2000 per day"
    Well, yea, you'll undeniably lose weight like that but you wouldn't really need the advertised product to begin with, would you?
    Similar with noFap. If you do noFap and also go to the gym, meditate, practice social interactions, change your diet, pick up productive hobbies and so forth, you will feel happier, more confident, less depressed...
    But you could also just do all those things without noFap and feel the same results.
    It's a bit of false advertising, if you think about it...

    Addendum: The only benefit I commonly read of that I would confirm 100% is "music sounds better". That is entirely true and it's awesome. But it's a bit underwhelming in comparison to all the alleged benefits...
     

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