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Porn Isn't The Bad Guy

Discussion in 'Porn Addiction' started by OneWithTheUnderdogs, Jul 14, 2017.

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  1. Although rightly people who have problems with the consumption of porn actively find reasons to hate it, i believe it's also important for the addict to accept that ultimately they have to take responsibility for their own actions and behaviours, else it will become very difficult to overcome. There is a difference between outright blame of external factors and recognising where something is harmful to yourself and seeking to resolve it. There is much hypocrisy amongst porn users, for example they might not agree with human trafficking, coersion, praying on vulnerable young adults, yet they would still actively support the industry by indulging in the content that is produced. Porn consumption is a well known factor amongst criminologists and psychologists that increases the risk of criminality in individuals....where exactly do you think sex offenders get their training from? i'm not saying every one who views porn is going to commit a crime, but for those who commit a sexual offence, pornography is often one of the driving factors, especially amongst young and impressionable people who 'want to try out' what they have seen, forgoing the rules of consent. There are people who are especially vulnerable to the hold porn consumption has on their mind.

    The more information that can be taught about the negative consequences of porn, would surely help these individuals to prevent developing problematic behaviour. Porn is not going away, that much is true, the horse has bolted long ago, but how seriously does society take the impact of porn on our younger generations minds? When a child views porn it is not that different from an adult grooming that individual, the porn industry does not care how old it's consumers are because frankly, the younger they can get them hooked the more profit they can make in the long run, they are a business not a charity and have no interest in the health and well being of it's customers. Much like a drug dealer really who uses the argument 'it's not my fault they want it'
     
  2. LavaMe

    LavaMe Fapstronaut

    This is a question of morality which can be contentious. I'll just say this, I wouldn't want my son, daughter, mother, father, grandmother, grandfather, or spouse to be a porn 'star', producer or consumer to any degree. I wouldn't be proud of it. I wouldn't brag about it. I would hide that fact and be ashamed. So that tells me that it is in fact evil.

    Or it could be 100% and 100%. The porn could be an instrumental cause or our addiction. Without the porn we could become addicted to it. But we also are fully responsible for our actions.
     
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  3. OneWithTheUnderdogs

    OneWithTheUnderdogs Fapstronaut

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    Thanks everyone for sharing your thoughts on this subject. Some of them were more "interesting" than others...

    I feel that the reason that I'm rather more blasé on the matter is because I haven't experienced the disastrous effects of porn that many people on here have detailed. I can't imagine what it must be like to have your life completely destroyed because of porn. I have experienced symptoms of over-use of PMO, such as brain fog, ED, and general feelings of demotivation and numbness. These disappear completely after a couple of weeks of abstinence though.
    I've never needed to reboot for more time than this. I've abstained for much longer and experienced no benefits past the 2/3 week mark.
    Please don't come at me with retorts of "that's nothing you need to not even look at your own dick for 10 years in order to fully reboot". I've experimented with "rebooting" periods and benefits from lengths of time gone without PMO and I know what works for me.

    Back to my original point, I never meant to offend (clearly I did!). It was merely an observation taken from personal experience. When I felt that my porn habit was becoming troublesome, and I really, REALLY wanted to quit, I did. For me, it was as simple as that. I indulged in a pleasure because it was fun, but when I realised that I wasn't performing (in all aspects of life) as well as I knew I could, I educated myself on the subject of porn addiction, and I stopped PMO. There was no real afterthought. For this reason I find it hard to sympathise or even empathise with people who know that porn is a real problem in their lives but continue to indulge in it.

    I have always been of the opinion that humans are completely in control of our own minds. The mind is a powerful thing, and you cannot allow it to be hijacked by an external force. If you're not in control of every aspect of your life, you can never truly attain greatness.

    I am not disputing that I was/am not an addict, but what I am saying is that I wanted to quit, so I did. Nothing more, nothing less.

    I'm proof that willpower can prevail. You just need to tap into its full ability to help you.
     
  4. LavaMe

    LavaMe Fapstronaut

    At 26 you aren't battling a 26 year long use of porn. It could be different. Then again someone could use it for just a short while and get seriously hooked.

    I don't think people are completely in control of their mind. That certainly isn't my experience. I experience thoughts that just come into my mind. I don't will them there. That seems a common experience based on what others say.

    Willpower is weakened by habit. If you have a porn habit, regardless of if you call it an addiction, then you have weakened willpower. It is true you have to want to quit to quit. But for many it isn't as easy as just deciding you want to.
     
  5. Mr Eko

    Mr Eko Fapstronaut

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    As I can see on your PMO counter you are 44 days free. It's a proof that human willpower can a lot sometimes.
    But to mean that men are fully in control of it is a mistake.
    I had had 3 times a period of abstinence that took about 1 year. I accomplished it only with my willpower. But it didn't mean that I quitted this addiction. Every time after these sober periods I gave up some day because of too long urge, lessened motivation, wanting to experience the most exciting pleasure...
    Then I was in full addiction again, even deeper and worse to make up for the ,,lost,, time.
    It's the human pride which thinks that man is strong and able to do amazing things. Babilon tower.
    The addiction is given to men to crash this ill thinking, to get to understand that the human will can a lot but not always and not all.
    To realize that most of time we are weak, sometimes out of control is a big chance to change life.
    Pride is always the cause for failure.
    I had believed for 30 or so years that my will power can beat this addiction. No, it can't.
    Only so called Higher Power can do it.

    Sorry, but 44 days are not a proof that you got rid of this addiction. Add 1000 clean days and it won't be a proof too.
    Some days ago I read on this forum that a member after 6 clean years gave up and binged the next 4 years.
    Pride is the cause.
     
    Last edited: Jul 20, 2017
  6. I think the OP isn´t 100% false.
    Maybe 75%.
    It is partially true, that some people are more likely to become addicted. And this does not depend on the drug they use, but on their environment. If you have a good social circle (friends, family), live a generally healthy life, are satisfied with it, etc... Then you are less prone to addiction.
    How else would you explain someone getting addicted to coke for example and others just using it 2-3 times a year and not having any problems with it?
    It is true, that we cannot just blame porn for everything. We lived that unhealthy lifestyle, that got us addicted in the first place. But to say it is all our fault is simply not true.
    Think back to the 70s for example. Were there as many porn addicts, as today? Of course not! So what changed? The people itself? In a timespan of 40 years? Highly unlikely. Evolution takes usually 10000 years to fully implement a certain trait. It´s the internet. Porn is so accessible these days. And it´s designed to be addictive, to make profit.
    Imagine the coke example above:
    Take the coke, modify it chemically and you get crack. Then make it accessible in every household for free. Then tell them it´s actually healthy. Would you still say it´s the addicts fault, that he becomes addicted?
     
  7. OneWithTheUnderdogs

    OneWithTheUnderdogs Fapstronaut

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    This is spot on.

    There was a huge overhaul on Portugal's drug scene in 2001, whereby their government legalised the use of all drugs. Yes, I mean ALL.
    Their reasoning was that the high percentage of drug users wasn't due to the abundance of drugs, but due to the users' current lifestyle and environment. The money they subsequently saved from completely scrapping "the war on drugs", not imprisoning dealers/users etc, they put into rehabilitating the afflicted; getting them clean, educating them, providing them with homes and jobs. Perhaps not unsurprisingly, Portugal now has one of the lowest overdose rates in the entire world, with only 3 overdose deaths per million citizens, compared to the EU average of 17.3%.

    Not only were overdose fatalities at at all time low, but after their environments were completely turned around, the vast majority of previous addicts never thought about going back to their old ways.

    The program displays undeniable proof that addiction is a product of one's environment and lifestyle. I wholeheartedly agree. Many NoFap users simply try and overcome their addiction without changing anything about their lifestyle. When I say "willpower can prevail" I mean that you need to have the willpower to change your surroundings, not just the will to quit porn.

    People rely on the support of this forum too much. You need to take charge and take control of your life, or nothing will change.
     
  8. jaybo

    jaybo Fapstronaut

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    I think there's a lot to be said for the ideas on this thread. When we look to improve our lives in general, do things that are important to us, make time to strengthen our important relationships, solve our problems, then troublesome behaviours become easier to manage and sometimes fall away.

    It's what we want as well, we don't simply want to be free from compulsive behaviours, but to have lives that are satisfying, fulfil our own values and make sense to us. That's more important to me than whether porn in and of itself is inherently destructive to all of its users, I don't know personally, the answer to that question.
     
  9. OneWithTheUnderdogs

    OneWithTheUnderdogs Fapstronaut

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    This is the kind of answer I specifically asked people to stray away from in my previous post.

    It is proof, because I know my mind is strong enough to keep me away from what I now know is dangerous. If your mind is not, that's on you to change that.

    For someone who is majorly addicted, and I'm talking constant porn watching and masturbating for hours every single day, never socialising, not doing anything to better themselves, yes, maybe 365 days is what they need to recover, but for a casual user like myself, I know what I need, as it is MY body and MY mind. I will not be dictated to by people on a porn addiction forum (no offence).

    If you've been battling this for 30 years and still feel like you're not over it, then man, you've got a serious problem.

    Just because it takes you or anyone else here years to overcome this doesn't mean it's going to be the same for everyone else.
     
    LivinginRecovery likes this.
  10. Estus

    Estus Banned

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    I don't have anything nice to write to you so I won't write anything at all.

    I still wanted to tell you that though.
     
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  11. OneWithTheUnderdogs

    OneWithTheUnderdogs Fapstronaut

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    That's okay, I can imagine the gist of what it would have consisted of.

    Thanks for your pointless comment anyway though :)
     
  12. I sure believe that all the free porn fed my problem. I did in the past have 8mm films, then VHS and DVD's to watch porn with. But those forms required some effort to acquire and view. How inconvenient it was to set up a projector before you JO. I did do it but for sure not so often or for so long a time span. When I was a kid I didn't need anything to MO to . I used to JO watching tv shows which by any means in the 60's didn't show much sexy stuff. But for a kids mind was enough. Then it was playboy and stuff like that that got me next. As a others have stated the porn I viewed over time got more and more perverse as I searched . BBW, granny,trans,glory hole,CFNM became my hunting ground . It been a month for me and my only slip up was to go on Craiglist once an look at the personals. It use would be easy to go to a site and waste hours edging but going to go and WO instead.
     
  13. Why are you even on this forum?
    You don´t need help. You are obviously strong enough to do this on your own.
    Is it because you are a wise, generous person, who wants to share his infinite wisdom with us? The master plan? The one and only solution for all our problems? Go ahead...
     
  14. CrumplyCrumps

    CrumplyCrumps Fapstronaut

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    I agree man

    Fappy fappy,
    Nappy nappy,
    This is my life
    Because I'm not happy

    I believe porn is a problem for people because they have underlying problems.
     
  15. Spiff

    Spiff Fapstronaut

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    I think part of the reason sometimes communication breaks down on this forum is that people have very different ideas of what addiction means.

    Psychology seems to agree with the above sentiment - that something is only an addiction if it utterly ruins your life. The APA will tell you if you can jerk off to porn a few times a week and it doesn't turn you into some kind of suicidal drooling sex fiend lurking in dark alleys then everything's just fine.

    Personally, and I think this is true of at least some other people here, addiction simply means something I do that I don't feel good about that I seem to have a hard time completely stopping. Maybe this is because some people consider porn a serious moral failure and not just a bad habit like watching too much TV.

    I've maintained a perfectly functional life and functional marriage while looking at porn something like 20-50 times a year for nearly a decade now, less each year, and I believe I have an addiction that requires a concerted effort to stop. I won't consider myself healed until I've quit for a couple years at least, and even then I'll have my guard up.

    Still think this was the most concise and accurate response in this thread.
     
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  16. OneWithTheUnderdogs

    OneWithTheUnderdogs Fapstronaut

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    Thank you :)
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Aug 2, 2017
  17. OneWithTheUnderdogs

    OneWithTheUnderdogs Fapstronaut

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    I ask myself the same question sometimes.

    I think it was a combination of morbid curiosity and genuinely believing I had a problem.

    Do I have a problem? Hard to say...

    I have a great life; a beautiful girlfriend, run a successful business and am a generally happy guy. When I decided to take control of my porn use, I was initially surprised at how strong the cravings for it were. Saying that, they're easy to ignore. I simply close my laptop and go and do something else.

    Do I spend every day obsessing over NoFap/constantly fighting off urges to watch porn/avoiding any and every kind of "trigger"? No, it doesn't even cross my mind most days. I just don't do it.

    I never watched porn because something in my life was missing. I have a very fulfilling life with or without porn. I masturbate(d) to porn because it felt/feels good, nothing more nothing less.

    I'm a very strong willed and independent person, and I don't need the support of anyone on this forum. I do however find reading about other people's experiences fascinating, and I have found some very insightful and intelligent opinions on here. For the most part though, this place is full of very angry, frustrated and bitter men who will bite off anyone's head who doesn't share their cult-like set of rules for "rebooting".

    I don't have a "master plan" or the ultimate cure, I just like to think I offer a difference of opinion and a breath of fresh air amidst all the garbage on this forum.

    What I will say is this. If you feel like you've reached the end; that place where you've tried over and over again with no results; change your entire life. Dissect all aspects of your life that are making you unhappy and take practical steps to change them. If you hate your job, quit. If you're unhappy in your relationship, break it off. If feel stagnant, pack your shit and go travelling.

    Life is too short to spend it moaning about parts of your life that you dislike. If you're unhappy, there's always, always a way to change that.

    I'm not here to piss people off, I just like to see how people react to somewhat unpopular opinions. These are however MY opinions, and you're well within your rights to disagree with them, but at least respond to me with a well thought out and insightful response. Hurling insults at me with no follow up makes you look childish, insecure, and uneducated. It's not a good look.

    Change your life, and never give up on trying to find happiness. It's the greatest free pleasure we have in this life and we all deserve to experience it.
     
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  18. Mr Eko

    Mr Eko Fapstronaut

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    Yes, suppose it were true. But look, what if almost everyone on this site besides you is only weak willed?
    You give advice for strong willed men but we here are mostly weak or even everyone besides you.
    This advice above is only for strong willed men. I must admit that your advice is really good but not for us here. You try to find here strong healthy men. Not on this site. We are sick, our lives have been sick. So, unfortunately, your advice is worthless here. It's nothing to offend you but what you're trying to do is to persuade a lame man to run as fast as healthy teenagers.
     
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  19. OneWithTheUnderdogs

    OneWithTheUnderdogs Fapstronaut

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    I disagree.

    Everyone has the ability to be strong willed. It's all about finding the confidence within yourself.

    I don't believe anyone here is "weak" but I do believe that they feel that they are. Just as you believe that your addiction is controlled by your mind, so is your ability to overcome it.

    It's all a matter of finding the strength and the desire to succeed.

    The notion of impossibility comes from a lack of belief in one's self. If you really, truly want something, there is always a way to obtain it, but it involves a lot of strength, commitment, and sacrifice.
     
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  20. Mr Eko

    Mr Eko Fapstronaut

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    If so, how would you explain that I have been over 3 years clean but simultaneously I don't believe in myself at all?
    I remember a long time when I tried to believe in myself, in my power, abilities.... This very long period was when my addiction ruled over me. Now my faith in myself is null and zero.
     
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