Loneliness

Discussion in 'Loneliness' started by crrispiness, Apr 24, 2019.

  1. crrispiness

    crrispiness New Fapstronaut

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    loneliness was the cause of recent relapses for me. I just got out of a 2 month relationship with ALOT of sex. It’s hard to Maintain a non sexual mindset. Any thoughts will help
     
  2. You're not alone in feeling that way! It's definitely an adjustment, but it is possible. Try to keep busy during the days and find some hobbies you can get into. You can do this!
     
  3. Embrace

    Embrace Fapstronaut

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    Well, I feel that in my case, masturbation and porn is actually the illusion of relationships. I relapsed severly after some years , after big problems in relationships. So it just something to cover up deep trauma. Therapy cost a lot, I am doing some but could use more, and hard to find a job or financial care in my state of anxiety. What I would need is love, as in a compassionate partner, not necessarily romantic, but anyway, a community, real human presence, non judgemental that could help me process my feelings. Not using porn for a while just makes those feelings remerge, and relapses are way fewer when I have even the slightest healthy social contact. I would say it is the absence of true friendship, wheter this element can be found in family relationships, social circle, romantic, or spiritual. I lack that friendship element. And you can say you have to be your own best friend but that is not actually good enough, I read about and we are social creatures, our brain is made that way, so lack of true friendship is a like an automatic trigger. Mystics in caves usually had other kinds of friendships in the spiritual plane. Or the imaginary plane, who knows.
    I feel like am hungry and I am painting a rock in brown and deluding myself it is bread, and start chewing and eating it. Some momentary solace, at the price of destroying my teeth and my body s digestive system. But in some perverse way, it is better than hunger. And the current mindset is so hedonistic and individualistic that people, me included are conditioned to think that sadness is wrong, suffering is wrong and being a friend without some kind of clear exchange policy is wrong and somehow just enabling others. It is good to enjoy some pleasures, it is good to take care of oneself and not enable others, but with a balance of respect for sadness, anger, pain, and compassion. Having been refused that from my closest community is heart wrenching and mind blowing. And as sad as this might seem, porn does not reject my and gives me space and a break from this hectic life. Not a good one, but one nonetheless. It is fake and harmful, but sometimes, fake and harmful feels better and is better actually in some degree to my reality. Started to understand how many working class families have massive problems with alcholism. Poor, judged and used. This and also artists. Maybe rich in money, but just shallow masks for the enjoyment of others. Our soul is empty. Porn does not help in the long run it just the void bigger and stronger, but for a brief moment, you feel in another world. And that feeling, our bodies feel is more precious than anything we might have right now in our life. Just going a little scientific and humorous, nothing gets that serotonin and dopamine up.

    In pain and in hiding.
     
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  4. Freedom_from_PMO

    Freedom_from_PMO Fapstronaut

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    Loneliness is cause for lots of coping mechanisms and porn is one of them. Dopamine rush might help you forgot for a moment, buy is it worth it?
     
  5. Embrace

    Embrace Fapstronaut

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    Well, it is, in some way, otherwise our bodies would not do it. Our bodies are not stupid, even we often assume them to be. As I said, if you do not feel or do not actually have anything better, than it is worth it. I can now safely admit I would take PMO anytime over severe anxiety and loneliness. The problem, to say it, is that many things that could replace it, are vastly more expensive, in terms of effort. Satisfying relationship, support group, even therapy, a nice occupation, good diet and exercise. And many times you just don t have that kind of energy. I do not. And in the end, why is a long life of suffering with just maybe 1 tenth of good experiences worth it and not semi regular PMO? Religions solve this issue quite easily, that is why in a way I wish I could be more religious, and that is through the reward of eternal life and cost of eternal torture. So like the ultimate , continous orgasm without any of the drawbacks. Any animal would take that shot. Quasi certain reward over extremely uncertain life conditions.
    And let us face it, leaving all the fantasies aside, this life is frought with suffering. Every job, every relationship, and PMO gives a short circuit to all that. Is it worth getting up every hour or so or or worrying endlessly about a child? Some say it is. Maybe that is just their brain screwing with them and trying to seem ike all that effort was for something. It is known that one of the things that keep people in cults is the sense that if they recognise it was all baloney, than they would have wasted so much, and that, to subcounscious and even conscious is a no no. But it might be worth it. Again that is the conditioning we have received as to be a happy life and fulfilled life.
    Not trying to nihilistic here, but just trying to get to the root of the issue. And this only for me, I get that for many a good family life feels worth , or a proffesion. Trying to figure out that thing or those that would really matter to ME, really, from the heart, that would make me say, yeah, this is life is worth more than drugging myself in best ways I can and kill myself when that would not be possible for too long a time. Don t get me wrong, not suicide because my sandwich was too cold, more the terminally ill and in pain kind. I have lived a life trying to satisfy others, my parents, my version of god, people around me, teachers, therapists and so on, and just got tired of being the go to whore or slave or other narcisstic need supplier. Fuck you to those kind of demands of me.
    Sometimes I think the way out of an addiction is finding something that matters more than the addiction. Otherwise, without the addiction, just comes the daily irritations of living.
     
  6. theriser

    theriser New Fapstronaut

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    Thats i guess best way keep it up
     
  7. Freedom_from_PMO

    Freedom_from_PMO Fapstronaut

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    was much more anxious, insecure and actually dperessed, when I was addicted. Now I am just sometimes sad about loneliness. PMO id absolutely not worth it. Reset? Maybe, but sense of failiure would be bigger than ang profits.


    I have good support circles, I don't need therapy currently, I diet and excercise. I only really miss relationship, but I'll work hard to have one.

    I am very religious and that really helped my in darkest moments.

    I would not call salvation ultimate orgasm, I guess you wers thinking about ultimate pleasure, that is kind of true but there is more to it. It is liberation from vice and personal experience of relation with absolute Goodness, Truth and Beauty that is God. I don't think it can really described, at least I can't, I am still here.
     
  8. Embrace

    Embrace Fapstronaut

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    You know, language cannot really describe anything. To really describe something, it must be that something. So any representation falls short of the reality being represented in some way.

    Also, you can just be imagining stuff. Which is ok. Like this relationship with the divine can just be make believe. Which is fine, because we all live in some kind of make believe in a certain extent. There is a documentary, Kumare, about a guy pretending to be a guru and people having all sorts of experiences which they thought were real. And the experiences were real, as in they happened, but that does not mean their intepretation is real. If you really think that there is God out there who loves and protects you, and you reinforce that daily, that is bound to make you feel various things. Which you can call anything. Like liberation from vice. You have your definition of vice, and so on. It could all just be a construct in your head. Atheism and relying on science could also be that. I also have these things. Maybe in a couple of years you will become atheist, and say, well , those experiences were just heightened emotional states, brought on from child or adult indoctrination, hypnotic practices, group experience, pressure from authority, etc. Many people seem to think that. I am not arguing here that this will be the case, it just that , as religions and psychology showed, what people feel consciously is usually not all they feel.

    I mean some people use terms like ultimate truth, ultimate goodness and beauty to describe any sort of experiences, from the christian god, to the hindu gods, to platonic visions, to drugs, to sex, to flowers, to art, to anything.

    What I am saying is the human mind s ability to distinguish between reality and imagination is not that good. How many couples, married for years, divorce saying things like, I thought he was a good man, but he turned to be a cheater, etc, and that is for someone who lived right next to you.

    Conviction and experience are not a proof of even ordinary truth, not counting ultimate truth. Usually people just feel good and tend to exagerrate. I do that, it is just emotional enthusiasm. This is so cool! translated very easily to this the ultimate truth and love!

    And the Christian narrative for example, has some very inspiring elements. Fulfills the need to mean something, of safety and order, affection, survival - I mean people survive death like Jesus, elimination of guilt through confession, the idea of ultimate equality and worth, so there is not need to envy someone. It just fulfills a lot of basic psychological functions . Also it can be a very potent mind control system. All cults fulfill some needs and have some experiences. Nazism had that, the ideology, the leader, the symbolism, the rituals, etc.

    I say this because you describe feelings. And feelings are many times not so accurate descriptions of reality. Plus is it not weird as so many religions contradict each other, although they use the same words to describe divinity? For example, christian theologians and scholars described Mahomed with everything from a demon possesed, a rapist and pillager, the Antichrist, a stealer and copier, a mad man, etc. How could anyone following those teachings have any kind of real mystical feelings about god, and sufi teachings are full of these the all embracing love and truth and unity and such and such....

    I can feel extremely zoned out and so well when I am pmoing. I could call that ultimate beauty, couldn t I?

    By the way I spent a year and a half travelling and staying and praying and talking to the monks of Mount Athos, a millenial christian mystical millieu which has influenced christian orthodoxy all over the world. So these issued of mystical experiences are not a foreign element to me. Nor am I a master, god forbid, but still.

    I do agree though that personal conviction does go a long way. Viktor Frankl quoted Nietsche in saying, the man which has a why, can endure anything. I would go so far as to say anything, but hey.

    I am not starting a debate here
     
    Last edited: May 15, 2019
  9. Freedom_from_PMO

    Freedom_from_PMO Fapstronaut

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    I fact my faith isn't based on feelings or my conviction, they are not the reasons I believe it is true. I consider both the Gospels and theologicals arguments for God to be true. I am fairly rationalistic to be honest. You have the assumption that religious faith is conviction + mystical experience + sense of purpose. It is not worth at all if there would be no defence of dogma in the first place.

    Faith helped me in bad moments because of moral guidance that I accept as not only divine inspired, but also philosophically accurate.

    Salvation happens after death, so I wasn't pretending I felt anything like that because I am alive. As I said I do not rely on feelings.

    You can call PMO your own ultimate experience, but you have no knowledge if it is just your subjective best experience or objectively best thing ever. I assume you are a materialist not idealist, so you are limited to your own experience in extension to other peoples described experiences, you are not discussing platonic Ideas. The Idea of absolute beauty is not most beautiful thing available, but most beautiful thing possible, even if this is beyond human imagination. In theism this characteristic is attributed to God.

    Argument that there is something off because religions contradicts each other only work if you assume that mystical experience and feelings are proofs. As I said it is worthless without believable revelation and consistent theology. Faith is about being true and about worshipping true God, not making you feel good. Believer is for God, not God to entertain the faithful. By the way the idea that you can judge morality of your actions from how you feel about them is condemned as heresy by the Catholic Church. Of course religious belief can bring moral integrity, sense of purpose etc., but those are side effects.

    I am rambling like that because I noticed, no offence, that you don't get what religion is about. I don't want a shitstorm, I want to clarify my perspective.
     
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