Dopamine and betrayal

Deleted Account · Mar 8, 2019

As an SO of a porn addict I've researched and learned a lot about addiction, and I've also learned that often the addict's craving for dopamine is more powerful than their desire to not hurt their loved ones and generally wanting to avoid negative consequences, which are controlled by different areas in the brain. Now I've been wondering if dopamine is dependant on novelty, shock, anxiety and disgust, is it possible that the feeling of committing betrayal might actually fuel the addiction? I just wonder if there is a pattern behind addicts responding to novelty by escalating to novel porn genres compared to escalating in the form of shocking, disgusting genres or behavior by betraying their partners? Are there any PAs that have felt like the more forbidden their porn viewing habits were by acting against their SOs, the more rewarding it would feel?

EyesWideOpen · Mar 8, 2019

AngelofDarkness said: ↑

As an SO of a porn addict I've researched and learned a lot about addiction, and I've also learned that often the addict's craving for dopamine is more powerful than their desire to not hurt their loved ones and generally wanting to avoid negative consequences, which are controlled by different areas in the brain. Now I've been wondering if dopamine is dependant on novelty, shock, anxiety and disgust, is it possible that the feeling of committing betrayal might actually fuel the addiction? I just wonder if there is a pattern behind addicts responding to novelty by escalating to novel porn genres compared to escalating in the form of shocking, disgusting genres or behavior by betraying their partners? Are there any PAs that have felt like the more forbidden their porn viewing habits were by acting against their SOs, the more rewarding it would feel?
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This is very intriguing and isn't without merit. The idea of it definitely shouldn't be dismissed.

I think there are many people that are naturally drawn to the excitement of the "forbidden." They find a particular thrill in doing things they shouldn't be doing, including stepping out on a loved one. They like the danger of possibly being caught, the attention and adrenaline of it. Yes, there is such a thing an addiction to dangerous, exciting behavior. I think it is independent of an SA/PA but certainly one can be both.

Deleted Account · Mar 8, 2019

GhostWriter said: ↑

No. Has nothing to do with it. It all surrounds the necessity for a dopamine hit. That's it. There is no interest in "...novelty, shock, anxiety, and disgust..." or "...the feeling of committing betrayal..." It's all dopamine. Great question though.

Not any more than if you take other forms of addiction like drugs or alcohol or eating disorders. For example, a woman may give a blowjob to get a hit of heroine to a man that she would never ever in a normal functional state. A man wouldn't rob a liquor store, stealing only liquor in a normal functional state. A morbidly obese woman, knowing that she is so dangerously fat, wouldn't sit on the sofa "grazing" and eating nonstop, not because she's hungry, but because she is predisposed to fuel her addiction to food. Interestingly, none of these addictions have anything to do with that which the individual is addicted. It has to do with something that goes historically much deeper into their background way above and beyond the addiction itself. The addiction became a coping mechanism for it. So, no, they don't seek these things except for one purpose only; a dopamine hit. And like all addictions, the addict has to increase the magnitude, frequency, and duration of the addictive behavior in order to maintain getting the same level of high they received the previous time.

This isn't exact, but it's what I like to use because so many people can understand it and helps explain why addiction by its very nature is progressive and escalating in nature. When something becomes exciting enough to produce a dopamine hit, it is the most powerful hit you've ever experienced. So you want to repeat it. Your body craves it. But when you go to repeat it, it is half again as effective as it was the first time, the last time. But that doesn't stop you. You go to repeat it a third time, and it is half as effective as it was the previous time, 25% as effective as it was the first time. A fourth time yields half again as effective as it was the previous time, 12.5% as the first time and so forth and so on. Eventually, it becomes so ineffective, you simply have to move on and find something else that is more effective, because it's not very effective at all. After 10 times, it's more than 500 times less effective than it was the first. So, it gets exponentially smaller each time. That's why addicts seek deeper, darker, more sinister material to get their dopamine high. They genuinely don't give the depth and disgust of their activities much rational thought at all, for if they did, they likely wouldn't do it. It's the mid-brain's propensity to override and veto any decision the frontal cortex makes because that's the brain's point for fight, flight, or freeze.

Again, because this has nothing to do with anybody but the PA, the SO isn't a part of the equation. In fact, if it were, I would submit to you that the likelihood of the PA acting on those behaviors would greatly diminish. It's the difference between being in control versus being controlled. Addiction is all about being controlled; not being in control. Make sense?
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Thank you for your reply. But it feels more like an explanation as to how desensitization and tolerance to dopamine occurs rather than an answer to my question. I'm not sure if it really explained why the feeling of shock and disgust that is connected to releasing more dopamine with tolerance to overused natural dopamine triggers, can't be applied to feeling shock and disgust by viewing pornography with the knowledge that it hurts the partner? The addiction would be in control of fueling dopamine release in both cases. Why isn't escalating to

animal sex

because of feeling shock and disgust the same as escalating to

webcam girls

which is escalating to another level of betrayal and therefore also causing feelings of shock and disgust?

Deleted Account · Mar 8, 2019

EyesWideOpen said: ↑

This is very intriguing and isn't without merit. The idea of it definitely shouldn't be dismissed.

I think there are many people that are naturally drawn to the excitement of the "forbidden." They find a particular thrill in doing things they shouldn't be doing, including stepping out on a loved one. They like the danger of possibly being caught, the attention and adrenaline of it. Yes, there is such a thing an addiction to dangerous, exciting behavior. I think it is independent of an SA/PA but certainly one can be both.
Click to expand...

Thank you for your encouraging post. I think adrenaline and dopamine are closely related, and a rush of adrenaline also results in a rush of dopamine. As you said, there are people who naturally have a predisposition to perceive dangerous and scary experiences as pleasurable and thus more rewarding. Some people enjoy watching scary/gory movies or crazy rollercoaster rides while other people will avoid them at all costs. So maybe addicts who have such predisposition will also be more inclined to escalate in the form of an adrenaline-dopamine rush.

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