Does your spouse know?

Discussion in 'Rebooting in a Relationship' started by WhiskeyNeat, Jun 3, 2019.

  1. Susannah

    Susannah Fapstronaut

    Preach it, sister! Don't spare me. I want the information I need to make decisions for myself. I guess I'm controlling that way....
    hope4healing and fadedfidelity like this.
  2. Seeking Help

    Seeking Help Fapstronaut

    Fadedfidelity I appreciate your opinion and your honesty and I'm sorry if my view offends you.
    I do genuinely know my wife very well indeed and I promise you, right now I'm doing what's best for her as I genuinely see it.
    As I continue my journey, my view may change. I may not being seeing things straight, my age old habit may well have skewed my perception. Time will tell.
    I don't know your story but I do know we are all different and one size doesn't fit all but I will keep your opinion, as well as everyone elses in mind and I will continue to assess and change when necessary.
    WhiskeyNeat and need4realchg like this.
  3. need4realchg

    need4realchg Fapstronaut

    Absolutely. The attempt to "control", "limit" "protect" "shield" is all part of the same mechanism that PA's use to do damage control and they completely side-swipe their partner's basic freedom to make a decision. This is what a man attempting recovery needs to know.

    They have the right to be free of their habit, and their SO has the right to be free from their struggle.

    Most SO's don't cut bait, right away at least, unless there's something else to the story, but ALL PA's fear they will. So they are acting on fear. Their intent to protect is based on fear.

    I believe anything using a fear-based model post PMO needs to be challenged to see if it's healthy or not.

    Being afraid an alligator could eat you will save your life in the everglades
    But being afraid an alligator will eat you when you turn off the lights is an immature fear, as men we must challenge the fears that don't let us grow up.
    Sadgirl and hitnmis like this.
  4. Sadgirl

    Sadgirl Moderator Assistant Staff Member Moderator Assistant

    I DISAGREE COMPLETELY. Secrets only hurt a marriage. It is 100% up to tge SO what level of detail she wants and needs. A man who has breeched his wife's trust really should do whatever is required for her to feel safe-it isn't snooping-it is her looking to make sure that her lying husband isn't still a liar. It is all about safety.

    This sounds like compartimentalizing. True integrity is a man being who he is regardless of who he is with.
  5. need4realchg

    need4realchg Fapstronaut

    Thanks for speaking in this thread, I appreciate your perspective; l see your reasoning that all secrets hurt a marriage; let me ask you if you have watched or are familiar with dr. Weiss?

    He is the psychologist who advocated sensitivity; ie times when the wife should get a disclosure and are times to have disclosure when not to have it. I actually learned that from another vocal SO here that has taught me quite a [email protected]

    I think it’s clear even he (Weiss) as a widely respected sex therapist, understands blanket statements like the one you made, cannot be walked back easily ; plus i don’t know all SO, or their mental health.

    In some of the examples he gives some cases where the wife is pregnant he does not do or recommend full disclosure. Another example is history of poor mental health. Another example I believe he gives is when the couple are religious; and the SO knows that no matter the issue they will work through — in those situations the disclosure is not helpful either he says. The other examples he gives is when the one doing it is using the list to hurt his SO. In other words this is a subjective process; one that i would think a dogmatic approach is not advisable. I can post the video if you are curious.

    My point would be to gently suggest a less dogmatic, more sensitive—customized approaches can be more helpful and less damaging to the woman’s psyche in the event that the couple plan to remake their relationship.

    As for the “compartmentalizing”, I have done this in the past. I will review my comments to see if I was actually advocating that—- if so I appreciate you saying so.

    What I thought I was advocating--- was that women don’t often see the “full picture of who they marry.” Men do. Men see it because when they are with other guys they do what was recently called locker room talk. That’s a way of speaking that women do not hear but men do. Another example i shared there was that when men are alone in front of a computer they often transform or change. This is what the addiction brings out. Very few addicts choose to do pmo In FRONT of anyone else. In this yes it’s an activity that only can occur when the man is alone. Men don’t pmo in groups. Not even in the sex shows or cinemas. Usually that act is private.

    So what I’m showing the OP is that he can consider opening up but he needs to build up his network first.

    Imagine I think I have Ebola. Is my priority to tell my wife and family or go to a doctor?

    I would think most of us would say go to the doctor; yes? In this case —a network that is particularly suited to support and help addicts open their issues without judgment and shame. I’m not saying that sharing with his wife and family is unimportant, it simply is not the first step when dealing with the problem.

    And I already outlined that an addict struggles with basic decisions when they first decide to come clean. They need a series of wins to open up to everyone especially an SO. By the way, that's WHY most therapists do the revelation/disclosure letter over weeks of preparation and why they do it together.
    Last edited: Jun 4, 2019
  6. fadedfidelity

    fadedfidelity Fapstronaut

    Haha, right. If that is controlling, then every man is controlling too!
  7. fadedfidelity

    fadedfidelity Fapstronaut

    hitnmis and Sadgirl like this.
  8. WhiskeyNeat

    WhiskeyNeat Fapstronaut

    Kudos to all the SOs that are here using this community in an effort to support their SO through this journey.
    fadedfidelity and Sadgirl like this.
  9. Sadgirl

    Sadgirl Moderator Assistant Staff Member Moderator Assistant

    Yes I have been a fan of Dr. Weiss for a long time-I watch his webinars twice a week. I did not make a blanket statement about what to disclose, I said "It is 100% up to the SO what level of detail she wants and needs. A man who has breeched his wife's trust really should do whatever is required for her to feel safe-it isn't snooping-it is her looking to make sure that her lyinghusband isn't still a liar. It is all aboutsafety.". I did not say "A man must disclose everything"-that would be a blanket statement. I feel it is up to the SO how much she needs to know.
    fadedfidelity and need4realchg like this.
  10. Sadgirl

    Sadgirl Moderator Assistant Staff Member Moderator Assistant

    I agree-addicts live in shame and I feel like if they can not open up to their wives, they need to open up to another man. Be heard. Remove shame. Be validated, and then told to man up and tell their wives what the wives need to know.
  11. need4realchg

    need4realchg Fapstronaut

    Yep. I'm nodding my head at all your comments. I don't see where we disagree, but I appreciate your vocalizing of your views all the same.
    WhiskeyNeat and Sadgirl like this.
  12. Chefb87

    Chefb87 Fapstronaut

    It's not your decision to make whether she should stay or go when you do tell her. You did what you did . If you do not tell her . You are lying to her, and most importantly yourself. Until you tell her everything and be honest with her and again most importantly yourself. You will never have the chance to fully recover . You are trying to control and manipulate what she does and doesn't do but what she knows and doesn't . It's her decision to make . Not yours. I felt the same way. It was the scariest thing k ever did. I figured my fiance would leave . But I had to let that control go , and have the " serenity to accept the things I cannot change ". As if now , my fiance took is hard, but she's still here, and now there's a chance we could really have a great relationship.
  13. frantrunks

    frantrunks Fapstronaut

    Oh man,

    This is not easy.

    When my wife was my girlfriend, I told her about my past. At that time I had been clean for a few months and I was like that after 2 years of totally clean conversation.

    After a marriage crisis I fell back and I have been struggling with this for 12 years. My wife does not know about my relapse but I know I'll have to tell her, the issue is that today she has other burdens to carry.

    I could not blame you for not telling you, I know how you feel and it's horrible, sooner or later you can talk about it and that will surely free you, although each case is different.

    God bless you, friend, let's move on.
    need4realchg likes this.
  14. WhiskeyNeat

    WhiskeyNeat Fapstronaut

    I know I need to tell my spouse that I am attempting to reboot. I know it’s the only way I will have accountability in this process. The concern I have is how impossible this struggle will be for her to understand. She has never PMOd once. She used to MO years ago but hasn’t in recent years. She has been in a 5 year flatline. There is no desire there at all. She would be blown away to hear that M is something I do everyday (until recently). Something I have done everyday since I was probably 12. I don’t see how she can possibly understand what I’m saying and take me seriously when I tell her I want it to be done. For her it’s easy. For me it’s been impossible to go more than 5 days.

    I feel she will be grossed out by this. It will make her think that I’m unsafe or something like that to be around. This subject is not something she is understanding about. I want to tell her but I cannot handle being judged by her for it.
  15. Sadgirl

    Sadgirl Moderator Assistant Staff Member Moderator Assistant

    it sounds like you are already judging her response that she hasn't even given you yet. I understand that you are frightened, but this is not fair to her. You say that she is in a 5 year flatline-what do you mean by that?
    Susannah likes this.
  16. WhiskeyNeat

    WhiskeyNeat Fapstronaut

    She doesn’t have much for a sex drive. Sex in our marriage feels like it’s out of obligation. If I approach her for intimacy I’ll often hear “get it over with”. I’m positive she doesn’t M on her own. She just doesn’t think about sex. It doesn’t cross her mind.

    I agree with you that I am jumping to conclusions. I am trying to prepare for all possible outcomes/reactions. But I feel the most predictable reaction from her will be disgust.
    need4realchg likes this.
  17. EyesWideOpen

    EyesWideOpen Fapstronaut

    Sex and intimacy are very different things. If you are PMOing on a regular basis, you are far from practicing any kind of real intimacy with your wife and she knows it. That's what porn does, it teaches you that you dont need intimacy, you just need to get off. She doesn't desire sex with you because you don't make her feel desired. You use her as an object, to fulfill your porn fantasies. She doesn't have to know that you look at porn and wank off daily to know that you are not present with her in bed.

    Her lack of desire for sex is not a reason for your addiction, but your addiction is probably the reason for her lack of desire.


    You created this. You have traded intimacy with your wife for fake self sex. You have chosen to look at thousands of other women instead of her to pleasure yourself.

    You must take responsibility for the hurt and pain you have caused in the lives of others, most notably your wife. She will probably be disgusted. You want her to throw you a party? We all are when we find out. It's part of the process. You'll both get past it as you work recovery and stay sober. If you think she won't get past it, then leave now, because why stay with someone if you believe they will be unbearable to live with if you told them the truth?
  18. need4realchg

    need4realchg Fapstronaut

    ok but ...

    Intimacy contrary to what most guys are taught, is not sex...

    What does M frequency have to do with sex? Many addicts M far more than they have sex... fair to say that’s nothing to do with sex drive , right?

    How often do you believe you have sex ?

    In other words I may jack off every day and have low or high sex drive. M is not a coefficient of sex drive.

    Secondly your statement about she won’t understand .... not to be an ass here...but she does not need to — you are being honest for you right??
    not because she asked you to do so. Provided she is not a minor nor mentally handicapped I don’t see why fear of misunderstanding makes sense. I mean no disrespect bro.

    Lastly your opening statement : you need to include her so you can be accountable in your reboot .... that’s not accurate. You can be accountable to a accountability partner and therapist. That keeps the slime off of her— and still you need a foundational network BEFORE you start emotionally dumping on her. She’s going to run from you and you will need to stand up by yourself while she processes all this. That’s what the network is for to help you stay on track.

    I think your relationship is best off if you include a therapist or third party instead of strapping a bomb to your wife’s chest and ask her to help you defuse it (making her your AP). That plan didn’t help my relationship and my wife wisely told me that she wasn’t going to enable me or hold my hand. I would need to man up. And honestly I am saying this having tried with both options.
    Susannah likes this.
  19. Sadgirl

    Sadgirl Moderator Assistant Staff Member Moderator Assistant

    @EyesWideOpen is 100% correct here. When hidden porn use is in a relationship with a man and woman it does not stay compartimentalized. It seeps into every interaction and every aspect of the couple's relationship. It changes the way you look at your wife, the way you desire her, and the way you relate to her. Women have intuition and I can guarentee that your wife has no sex drive because your desire for her has changed. And you are making assumptions about her not masturbating. Have you even asked her about it? I find it hard to believe that she "never" thinks about sex. Many emotionally and sexually neglected women give up on having sex with a partner who is addicted to P because it is formulaic and all about the man. Sex with a PA is monotonous and one sided. Like being a blow up doll. Anyone could take our place and I guess many women have-at least in the PAs mind. It's horribly sad.
  20. Everyonelies

    Everyonelies Fapstronaut

    I'm new here but I had to chime in.

    Fwiw, my take on this.

    First I give the SO on here credit and kudos for being supportive.

    Still I would express caution before just dumping this on your wife or anyone questioning the same thing.

    Every relationship is different, every one is different. Others are more supportive, understanding and empathetic then others. We are all different.

    Some recovering from PA might be in relationships where they feel difficulty communicating with their wife, justifiably so or not. Perhaps their wife has been verbally abusive, loud, angry. And it may have everything to do with what the husband is or is not doing but it's who their wife is.

    Confessing all of your horrible sins because you are trying to do the right thing for your wife or because it will give you some peace of mind IMO is not the right motivation.

    You can't just go and explode your marriage randomly.

    My other point...

    Instead, you need to decide to stop PMO. If you do, better yourself and focus on your her, I think your wife will become more receptive and responsive. Conversely to that many a wife can tell when porn is around, they can tell when it isn't I'd suspect. When you're stronger and you can say with confidence that porn is gone and you think it's best then find the right time after consulting a therapist or a marriage counselor. Perhaps with their assistance also. Cross that bridge when you come to it.

    I agree secrets are bad for marriages. What might be worse is continuing bad behaviors whether the SO knows or not. You need to fix you first, then you can fix the marriage. Because in reality for all of the PA that needed to tell their wife to stop, some fall back into it after they're told. Then you are a liar that won't change and you will feel like lowest filth ever.

    Again I'm not advocating keeping secrets. But I think what most people really are most interested in is change when it comes to their SO. If you cannot change without telling her, then it's something you need to plan out.

    It's difficult to chart these uncertain waters. But you need to be a better you.. For you.. Good luck!

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