Arming our daughters

Lmao...
Love the first line!


But this just hit you huh??

My daughter is also 14.

& my SO had the "oh shit our children are.." revelation not that long ago.

Yes.
It happens.
It's not just you.
Me.
Your wife.
Her husband.
It's the next generation.
Those babies we all made playing blocks last week in the living room now on the cell phones...


We were next to a guy at a ball game with my daughter... Who knows why he was there?
But he was freaking out that his 9 years ago daughter was going to have boobs and a butt to at 13 because all the 12-14year olds on the field looked like women.
I mean, he was freaking out.
Yeah dude.
Welcome to your rock bottom. Clearly.
Lol.


So... How can I help?

Having experienced... Everything you mentioned.

 

And Hugs!
That's rough.

 

i have two boys and i plan to teach them respect and model it. My husband is learning that they look up to him and he does not want to teach them to be the man he is right now. He wants them to be better then him and act like the man his becoming/

i read a quote in a book ( can't think of name ) (something like the truth behind porn industry)

sex is the gifting ones self to another. Sex is you giving your "wholeness" to them, and them giving their "wholeness" to you.

this is so true. ( that is why women are more into foreplay, etc)
My husband read that quote and Hmp? I have never thought of sex like that. No one has ever told me this.

I think teaching women (and men) that information will help.

 

This is such an important topic and is one of the biggest reasons I hate porn, what it does to our girls. Especially now when it seems every teenage boy has such easy access to endless porn, the girls are now growing up thinking that is what boys/men want and what they should be. That is such enormous pressure, and so wrong, especially given how much of it isn't even real.

I really appreciate the way you worded things here. Yes, we shouldn't have to arm our daughters this way because boys/men shouldn't act like they do towards women, but that is never going to happen so we have to arm them.

I have a daughter and a son. My daughter recently started developing and I was *freaking* out. My husband couldn't understand why I was so upset. I had to explain to him how now I feared she was going to experience everything in life that I did at that young age. To get unwanted stares, unwanted touching and groping by not only boys your own age but grown men. To have their boyfriend treat them badly. I had boyfriends treat me horribly when I was young, and some of it directly related to porn (they were acting out what they saw). I was assaulted as a teen (on the school bus and at school) more than once by boys putting their hands up my skirt, or grabbing my butt. I developed (really large) breasts super early on and that made me more of a target, I think. I can't even tell you how many times boys would grab my boobs, this was all done at school or on the bus. Now, that seems insane to me but it felt inevitable then. I don't want that for her! Honestly some of it I didn't even realize was wrong until I was an adult reflected back on these things. I think I was desensitized to it because it happened so often! Obviously I probably don't have to connect the dots here on how I think a lot of this behavior from males is at least in part connected to porn.

And yes, the unwanted pics, several times, and even in real life. I don't get why men think we just want to see that? Maybe because they want to see it from us (porn?)?

To combat the constant beauty messages for my girl, I try to focus a lot on other things when I am talking to her. Telling her how smart she is, what a good artist she is, how great she is at math and reading, how kind she is to others, etc. I try not to phrase things about beauty. I have seen moms telling their kids to suck in their bellies (that didn't exist) for photos, calling them fat, focusing on their own beauty or calling themselves fat in front of their kids, making everything about appearances or how you look in a selfie, criticizing their looks, their food choices, etc. I've tried to be insanely conscious about this ever since I had kids, but especially my daughter. I don't want her to end up with an eating disorder or body hate because of the messages she gets about herself. I know she will get those messages elsewhere in the world, but they sure as hell are not coming from me.

 

I don't have children myself, so I can't speak on that front. But I did see you pose the question on what advice we would give ourselves at that age, were we to go back in time.
I don't know what type of personality your daughter has, but I was a "fixer". I always needed to help people, be it friends, family, or boys. I needed it, in order to feel good about myself. It defined who I was. And in time I lost parts of myself that I could never get back, because I did not see that I was drowning in other people's problems and desires.

Boys always wanted my attention, maybe it was because I was the mothering type. And I was always careful about how I looked. Bullying got to me as a girl. See, I have one of those noses. You probably know the kind, the ones that stick out and have a huge bump right on the bridge. I was called Taryndactyl (My name is Taryn, Pterodactyl, ha freaking ha). I was called worse, too. And I had the opposite problem as @TryingToHeal - I was flat-chested until I was 15. All of the name-calling and hurtful remarks, they told me I'd never be attractive enough, never be wanted by boys. Suddenly I had boobs and everyone was all over me. I thrived on this attention, because suddenly I was worth it. Thus started the endless stream of boys, from age 15 all the way up to now, with maybe a 4-to-6-month break in between any of them. Sorry, that was more of a rant than anything else. Point being, I would tell little Taryn to think more highly of herself, and not let the mouth-breathers get her so down that she felt she was not worth anything other than sex. (Anyone enjoy the Stranger Things reference? huh? anyone? hehe)

This part I cannot stress enough: Safe sex. I don't know if you've already had 'the talk' with her, but safe sex, safe sex, safe sex. Even after having 'the talk' with my mom around probably age 16, I thought I was invincible. Even after seeing the gross pictures in sex ed of all the STD's you could possibly get, I lost sight of the truth of it, and at age 19, I contracted genital herpes. I had a moment of 'it'll never happen to me'. It can, and it will. Of course, it's always a good idea to get her on birth control, especially if she is starting to think about having sex. But as I am sure you are aware, birth control alone is not going to stop STD's.

In order to really avoid it, if there is someone she is thinking about having sex with, there needs to be an open conversation about any previous sexual partners, if there have been any. On how to have this conversation, I draw a blank because no one ever had it with me. I was always just told "don't have sex until you know you're ready to make that commitment". Which was good advice, just not enough. But you are a good father to do this for her, and I fully believe you will teach her the right things.

 

I'm from the U.S. Of A. And I will add that you should arm your daughters. Empty hand, gun, knives, pepper spray, A-10. Whatever they can legally carry and are proficient at using.

Teach them situational awareness b/c that is by far the best weapon. Teach them to never give up.

And teach all that stuff you mentioned too @anewhope.

I just like my people to have a last resort Arsenal when necessary.

 

For starters...
The first time I was groped I was 9.
It was on a school bus and I sat right behind the driver.
The other boy (8)
When I alerted the bus monitor, to what had happened didn't get punishment for touching where my breasts would be.. I got in trouble.
After another incident, I would learn to not speak when these things happened to me.
Always listen.
Let her know, you will Always listen.
Without judgment.
I show all of my children this.
Even my stepson.
His mother loathes the fact that he opens up to me.
It's because no matter how chatty I can be, I know when to shut up and I know when to fill the void with prattle.
Do not judge....
I am covered in tattoos.
I have colored hair.
I am college educated.
I speak either with grace or like a sailor home in Port.
It really depends.
I do this, always with purpose.
Personally, people judge me everyday.
But when I walk into meetings and people act like I can't do my job, I show my kids I can.
I think am the greatest example of the way to be open minded.
Kids will follow your physical example until they realize they don't have to.
Being selfish is good.
Knowing when you are being selfish for selfish sake is a good understanding of self awareness.
Practice this equally.
Sex..... Answer all the questions.
Any questions she has.
Even the ones that don't seem like questions.
It means different things to different people.
The best distinction I have is making a positive point of "sex and love are two separate things"
They can be the same thing... Buuuuutttt don't always go looking in the same place.

And teach about technology.
And cyber infidelity.


And if she's got a phone?
Chances are she's seen a dick pic.

Men just like doing this.
Idk why.
It's always unasked for.
Talk about it.
And Boundaries.
Figuring out what her personal boundaries are is important early on.
So she doesn't cross them and regret herself later.
Self loathing is a vicious cycle.
Good luck

 

I took a phone call...

And I could honestly discuss this at length... I have 5 kids

Safe sex... It's about consent too.

We started sex talks early here.

(This is a amazing subject to me.)

And also something else to remember-
Safe Sex
Is also Mentally Safe.
It's not making "little deals" with yourself that if you go a little further with him, or let him do this or if you do this with him, blah blah blah will be OK or whatever.
It's not compromising.
It's security.
With you and your body.
It's safety on all platforms.
@anewhope
I edited my remark.

 

I am 39 weeks pregnant and having a son. My husband and I have talked lengths about society, porn, men and women and sexual relationships. We want to be honest with our son (age appropriate of course) but we want to emphasize a household of respect, love and equality. We want our son to grow up with protected technology (i.e. protected devices with blockers/monitors), teach respect towards people, but making sure that he understands that women are people and not sexual objects (given that school kids might influence him differently), and have those sex talks as they grow up, not just one talk, but a continuous conversation about what sex is, how people should be treated, what consent is and that sex is and can be special when in a healthy context.

For girls, honestly, I wish I had someone to tell me back then that things the boys did and said were not okay. I would say make sure that you make your daughter feels comfortable enough to talk to you about this. I know that when I went to college and I was having my first boyfriend, I ended up calling home a lot and asked my dad questions about boys, about relationships, and about sex (I know not the norm, but I trusted my dad to explain these things to me so I would be prepared and understand things better). Addressing sex, relationships, self-worth are conversations that should be ongoing. I never really was close to my mom and never reached out to her because it seemed awkward. I would have rather my parents asked or check-in. I never told my parents about the boys who sexually harrassed me online, or the unwanted sexual attention from guys. I didn't know I could, really. I also was scared of being judged or being seen as bad, so creating an environment of safety and non-judgment can also help when these tough conversations come up. Also, let her know that if any misconduct does happen from other people towards her that it's safe for her to come to you and let you know and that you will believe her.

Also, my mom (I know she never intended it to come off this way) focused on complimenting me on looks, or focusing on what I ate. My dad, did give me compliments on my looks like when dressing up for a school dance, but I always felt valued for more than my looks with my dad because he complimented me on my intelligence and skills. So with daughters, I think there should be an emphasis on complimenting the individual on characteristics and not just looks. That way they understand their self-worth isn't based soley on their looks.

 

Cyberbully is on Netflix

It's got Emily Osment in it.
Maybe watch it together.
Amazing, emotional.... Freaky for kids.. I feel a must watch if u give your kids internet.

Everytime your kids go online, You are leaving them (essentially) in a room full of strangers.

 

I also....

Tell my daughters, my face?
It's from the spa.

It's my money to spend how I want.

When they were little they asked if TV girls had "spa faces/looks too"?

(Spas-costs money, have to go somewhere special to get it done)

Yes.

(out of 3 girls, only 1 sort of cares how they look)

I know my stepson is a little confused...
I was lucky when he noticed girls recently, I had some Halloween lashes on the sink to "show" example.
Funny story... My youngest (son) explained it to him.. Ha!

But Hollywood is fake.
And it's ok to be fake.
As long as you are doing it for you.
My story I tell is..
I'm not going to wear red lipstick, because I don't want attract people who like red lipstick.
Then I'd be stuck with wearing red lipstick and that doesn't make me happy.
I Do like to get my nails done.
I don't care if anyone else likes them...
I love my toxic green nails.
They are me.
This makes me feel happy.

 

I consider this one of the greatest challenges of my life. My boys are 10 and 7, and I've already begun talking to the ten year old. I hope to be a good example - I've been with the same woman since I was 19 and I sincerely hope to never look at porn again. I hope to instill in them the sexual values that I have with the hope that they can avoid the mistakes I made. I would be devastated if I ever found out they were ever malicious with their sexuality. I'm so worried because I feel as though the era I grew up in was completely depraved sexually and things certainly seem to only be getting worse.

To a certain extent, it's a roll of the dice. My Dad and stepdad were among the worst possible examples, yet I never mistreated females. I should say, I behaved as well as I could expect out of my young self with the values I inherited from my parents and society. I was no saint but from a young age (17) I completely rejected the whole casual sex conquest thing that most men are so into. Of course, I walked right into the porn trap but part of the reason I justified that is I felt as though I never really hurt any of those women. Of course I betrayed me wife with it, so I am by no means lifting myself up as some kind of a saint.

My wife was treated so horrendously by boys and men as a teen. Once I fell in love with someone who had been the subject of sexual abuse, it became such a tender spot for me. The thought of my boys ever participating in such behavior really makes me cringe.

 

My daughter is about to go away to college. We started from a very young age with the inappropriate touching talks, no matter who it is, from kids her age to people she loves in the family, it can come from anywhere and she will always be believed. We have a close relationship and have always been able to talk about dating, boys, safe sex...sometimes things I *really* don't want to know about. Considering the reason we are all here on nofap, the latest discussions, even though she knows nothing about the PMO issues between her father and I, have been about boys/young men and porn. We have talked at length that if she finds out someone she is dating is involved in porn, chances are it is not just "a little bit," and she does not have to put up with it in the slightest. She is a very confident, strong minded young woman so I have no doubt she will stand her ground. She has very high career goals and has mentioned more than once that she doesn't want to get tangled up with a boy early on in college so she will be throwing herself into her studies anyway. I believe her, she has decided to do that this year for senior year also.

 

Sadly my daughter was molested by my ex when she was only 5. It was my worst nightmare come true. She was always very mature for her age and we've always discussed it on her level. I still touch base with her on the subject on occasion. I used to be very worried about how this would affect her in the future. All I can do is pray for her and help her by surrounding her with lots of loving, good hearted people. I teaching her about forgiveness and about using her bad experiences to help others. We have a "No dating" until 17 rule but I prefer she wait till college honestly. I want her to concentrate on school, have fun with her friends and not worry about playing house or answering to a BF. There is plenty of time to date later, when boys have matured a little. Right now she is about to turn 15 and she's a great kid! She's an honor student, has a job, volunteers every week at church in addition to Youth Group and other social organized activities. Meets with her youth leader for Bible study, attends Christian club at school. She's also practiced Jui Jitsu for 5 years and participates in shooting competitions so that's another way she's "armed" for this battle..haha! I actually think I should start praying for her future husband bc she's not going to take any crap from anyone..she already doesn't lol. She's strong-willed and I thank God for her everyday!

 

Hi AnonymousAnnaXOXO,

Congrats to you.

Like you said it is very important to protect the next generation from this addiction. Ours was the generation when the internet just boomed, our parents were not familiar about the ill effects of internet (and the internet pornography that came along). So, they could not protect us and it is not their fault.

However, if the next generations gets addicted then it is definitely our fault because we are already aware how bad addiction are.

I am sure that you are going to be a wonderful parent. Good Luck and God bless you.

 

Life for a girl who is your daughter's age can be very difficult for a number of reasons, many which you listed already.

I think you're already doing the right thing by being a Dad who cares, and a Dad who is present and who is aware of what young girls especially are having to deal with in this life. I can distinctly recall my own Dad catching me hanging out with much older boys when I was about 13 , he did the right thing, he dragged me home one night by the ear and told those boys to stay away from me. Of course I hated him for it at the time, but in retrospect I'm glad he cared enough to embarrass me like that.

Life at the age of 12-15 for a girl is turbulent. We're going through puberty, starting to experience new feelings and desires (all of a sudden boys are cute!) At the same time, we also know that we're maturing faster than the boys, which is how we end up with older guys. Older guys who are looking for young, vulnerable, naive girls to pray on.

I also remember the low self esteem and the feelings that brought for me. Comparing myself physically to all the girls on TV, in magazines, other girls at school. Feeling "ugly"because I was different.

I don't know if any of that insight will help you, but I like your points you listed. I think the main focus should be on self esteem for young girls. It's a very challenging time, and they need to feel beautiful and feel proud of themselves. Hopefully she has hobbies and interests that can make her feel proud and accomplished. The focus needs to be taken off her physical appearance, and put on what she is capable of as far get talents, her hobbies, education etc.

She needs good friends, ones that will support her and stick by her through this turbulent time in life. I am still best friends with a girl I met when I was 14, and she is my rock. We've been through deaths, break ups, college, jobs, moving... And a lot of it the only reason I survived was because of her.

As for her access to the Internet, this may not be a popular opinion, but I grew up with very strict parents and we had no internet access until we were 18 and personally I would do the same if I had a child. Also no cell phones... My kids would hate me but it would be for their own good, just like it was when my father did the same for me.

 

I think, where we come from, as SOs... Is we remember how much we kept from our parents.
And the PAs panic with girls (daughters) because they now realize that they, are watching, using, whatever, someones daughter...
And they ultimately, don't want to be sitting there at Xmas dinner, worrying that their little girl is hiding the fact that they are a *** g*** or something because they f** them up.


-speaking in very general gender terms here..


And this is the 21st paranoia version of "I hope I don't make my daughter into a stripper" BTW

AND also, it's a very legit fear.
When at 6th grade... This is the average age of "first search"
But the first view is age 8, according to the latest studies (or so I've seen)

For children under the age 18, "porn" and "sex" are in the top five search terms of every search.

116,000 Searches are done daily for child porn.


So... If you think this is something to sweep under the rug, "let's talk about sex and not include porn...."

I think the world has a different view today.

 

Okay, I'm from TX, so I say make sure they're armed with guns! Haha, just kidding -- no, not really.

In addition to all the other excellent advice already given, I'd like to comment on how common it is for girls to seek out partners who are like their fathers -- and how common it is for boys to grow up into adults who act like their fathers. I know it's not the case ALL the time, but IS common. In my case, it rings true. My dad was/is a sex addict, and I've been involved with several SA's or PA's. My bf's dad is a PA, and my bf struggles with it, too. So, keeping on the P- and objectification-free path is of paramount importance. Whether it's on a conscious level or not, our daughters (and sons!) are picking up on how we treat and view others.

I had a conversation with my bf recently about his ogling and how it could impact his daughters. They admire and respect him, and when they see him ogling other women (and they already do or WILL notice if he doesn't stop), they will likely take that information into their minds and think that's normal and acceptable behavior. I fear they will then accept and maybe even seek that kind of behavior from boys/men. They might also conclude it's okay for someone in a committed relationship to still be lusting after other people (which is infidelity to me), and that women are to valued for their attractive body parts. This concerns me greatly.

As far as what I'd tell my 14-year-old self, it would be more conversations about self-respect and encouragement to pursue my own career and education goals instead of having my value wrapped up in trying to earn the "love" of boys. I would encourage more thinking ahead to my future and just be as fully present as possible to notice not just the verbal but also the nonverbal cues given by that 14-year-old girl.