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greetings, and potentially an unusual question

Discussion in 'Partner Support' started by WhiteFlower, Jan 23, 2017.

  1. Hello, people on this forum.

    First of all I would like to excuse myself for my level of English. It is not my native tongue...

    Before I get to my question, I think I need to start with some backstory. My fiance and I have been living together for around half a year now. I guess it is important to note that he is in his early 20s, and I am in my 50s. When we met, to our mutual surprise, there was strong chemistry between us, and, again to our mutual surprise, we later on decided to try to build something long term and lasting based on it, in spite of the reaction of our close people, and of society as a whole, which was mostly quite negative.

    We are both Christian, although I suppose I am a bit more "traditionally" Christian, and he "interprets" Christianity more. In any case, purity is something important for me. Recently I gathered the courage to discuss purity with him, in a not obtrusive manner, and to try to see what his thoughts are about it.

    He said he has seen porn in his teens, but that he didn't like it. But he said that he sometimes likes to look at sexy images (of young popular women) on the internet, and to masturbate to that, as a way to release some pressure and anxiety. He said that if he doesn't release the pressure for a couple of days, he feels bad and cannot sleep.

    I was surprised by this and didn't know what to say. For me purity is a very important thing, and I don't like the idea of these things he described happening in my home. I do not like the idea of my future husband masturbating.

    On the other hand, I don't have the feeling that it is an addiction for him. I also don't have the feeling that I can impose my probably outdated ideas on purity on him, or that I want to.

    So, I don't even know if this is the right place to ask about this, but I am wondering what to do. I am saddened that in this aspect he does not align with my "dream husband" idea, but I am not sure if I am right in that.

    So any advice would be very much appreciated.

    Thank you.
     
  2. i_wanna_get_better1

    i_wanna_get_better1 Fapstronaut

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    This is a classic example of how addiction starts. It starts off as a way to release stress and because it is such an effect way of feeling better that the brain stops learning other ways to deal with stress. But it is only an illusion of comfort because they are actually doing great harm to themselves and others. Eventually the images of young popular women will not be stimulating enough for his brain and he will have to escalate into more hardcore material.

    You may be correct and he may not be addicted yet, but there is not line people cross where they turn from a casual user into an addict. The fact that he feels bad and cannot sleep if he doesn't relieve the pressure shows that he has withdrawal symptoms when he abstains.

    Whether he is addicted or not, this is obviously having an effect on your relationship. Addicts cannot have a healthy relationship with someone else. Gradually the good qualities the person has fade away and gets replaced with anger, irritability, and selfish/deceitful/compulsive behavior. It lowers your self-esteem and self-worth. Watching porn is a betrayal to your relationship and you should not tolerate it if you don't approve. It is not old fashion. It has been studied over and over again - porn destroys relationships. Eventually porn will become the first thing in his life and you will become a distant second. Why wait until that point to say something?

    The good news is that if you don't think he's addicted then he should be able to cut it out of his life easily. I think it's a reasonable and important request. Do not let fear of consequences keep you from making this request. And if he chooses to continue and hide his habit then that will show you something else about his character.
     
    WhiteFlower likes this.
  3. Thank you for your answer!

    I understand that looking at sexy images online is a potentially addictive behaviour, which can be stopped / quit.

    Does masturbation work the same way? Is it not more like a physiological need for men?
     
    SMK likes this.
  4. Strength And Light

    Strength And Light Fapstronaut

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    I used to think it is a physiological need for men, and I was wrong. It's probably safe to say most men THINK it is a physiological need, like cutting your fingernails when then get too long. However, I have not masturbated in almost 6 months. Guess what? I'm still alive and all my organs work great!

    With that said, I don't think all masturbation is unhealthy. This is a grey area though. If a man is in his early 20s, and is not using masturbation to cope with or suppress his emotions, he is not using porn, and is merely using masturbation to relieve the physical symptoms of hormonal build-up, which can be quite substantial for someone his age, I do not deem it unhealthy in a medical or psychological way. You state the reason for your concern is because it violates your ideas of religious purity. From that angle, I cannot advise one way or the other.

    The best advise I can give you is to have an open conversation with him, and let him know all of your concerns. Perhaps show him yourbrainonporn.com and any other info that might be relevant. Then listen to him, honestly and openly, discuss his opinions and beliefs. I'm sure that two loving adults can come to a mutual understanding about it. I think you're on the right path by coming here and asking for advice, rather than demanding something you don't have firsthand knowledge of. Best of luck to the both of you - I'm sure it will work out for the best!
     
    HopefulChristian and WhiteFlower like this.

  5. Thank you!

    May I ask if after 6 months masturbation becomes less of a need, just like cigarettes would become less of a need after such a period without them? Or is it just as often felt like a pressing need? If that is not too intrusive question of course...
     
    SMK likes this.
  6. i_wanna_get_better1

    i_wanna_get_better1 Fapstronaut

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    It is a myth that men NEED to masturbate. It becomes a need when you fill your mind and dwell on erotic material. Rarely do men focus on the sensation alone when masturbating. They are thinking of someone doing something to them... or the other way around. So they start thinking about what they saw online, what they saw during the day, or someone from their past to fuel their masturbation session. Eventually that material becomes stale, so they look for new material to use.

    So you can see, on the surface, the idea of cutting out porn and only masturbating is a reasonable compromise. But rarely does it work long term. Once the brain knows where to get fresh material it will nag the person relentlessly to seek out new and novel images.

    When a person quits using porn their mind goes through withdrawal symptoms. This does not prove men need to PMO for their health. Rather, it proves just how dependent their bodies and brains have become to the powerful chemicals released during a PMO session. The mind fights against going back to a calm and stable state of mind. It demands excitement and it takes time to get used to feeling normal. That process often takes months of hard work and dedication.
     
  7. Hm, that's very interesting, thank you so much!
     
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  8. Strength And Light

    Strength And Light Fapstronaut

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    That's not too intrusive at all. Yes, after 6 months masturbation becomes much less of a need. On the average day, I am not walking around biting my knuckles, trying desperately not to masturbate. I think cigarettes is a good analogy, especially so because I was very addicted to masturbation. I am 41, so I had decades of masturbation behavior. Mostly what I am left with now, is breaking old habits. For example, my wife was out of town one night last week. It's my first night alone in a few months. This used to be a golden opportunity for me. So even though I am almost 6 months without it, and even though most days I get no cravings whatsoever, when I was alone for the night I had very intense urges. The urges weren't from being triggered by an attractive woman or a tv show or anything, it was just that I was in a situation in which I used to masturbate to porn. If for some reason my wife had to be out of town for a month, I would get very accustomed to it and would no longer get intense urges. I would adapt.
     
  9. If purity is important to you (and as a Christian it should be) then this is something that should be discussed. Never worry about what the world thinks of us - we only have one person to please and that is God. As spouses your job is to bring each other closer to Him, a successful marriage will have God in the center. The last thing God wants is a divorce so make things easier for you two in the long run by addressing this now. Premarital conseuling is always a good idea.

    As far as your "dream husband" goes, the only thing God really calls of us for marriage, besides waiting for sex, is to marry a believer. No human is perfect so I wouldn't worry about him not meeting your expectations otherwise. You can certainly talk to your fiancé about your concerns and pray for him. The Bible also suggests for us to marry a believer that is "equally yoked" meaning they are in the same walk of Christ as you. From what I can tell, you two are unbalanced in your belief but with God's help and willingness on both of your parts, He will better align you two in faith if you ask. No matter what, make sure he is someone you can see yourself spending the rest of your life with. When in doubt of anything just pray.

    I'm very curious about your story. I find myself attracted to someone older as well. Can I PM you? :)
     
    WhiteFlower likes this.
  10. Thank you for your answer. It is really helpful, as well as i_wanna_get_better's. It is really interesting to hear men say these things on this topic. The popular stigma on the topic nowadays is indeed different from that... But that is the case with many other truthful things.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Jan 24, 2017
    SMK and i_wanna_get_better1 like this.
  11. You are very right, and I was saying "dream husband" more in a self-deprecating sort of way (I suppose this didn't come through), kind of making fun of myself for sometimes wishing things to be of some sort of unattainable perfection, which, you are right, is not a very Christian thing to aspire to, especially in others; it is on ourselves we need to work. And I am definitely much more interested in working on myself in that aspect, on working on improving my understanding of how these things are: which is, I suppose, what brought me here.

    Feel free to PM me, although I am not sure how exactly that works in this site, and if I would have any sort of useful advice to give :)
     
    HopefulChristian and SMK like this.
  12. @Strength And Light @i_wanna_get_better1 you have been very helpful with providing your perspective... I have one more question: has quitting porn and masturbation been beneficial for you? Not in the sense if it made you a better person, but in the sense: do you feel better? are you happier?
     
    SMK likes this.
  13. Strength And Light

    Strength And Light Fapstronaut

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    There is sort of a chicken and egg thing for me. I don't know if I was so anxious and depressed because I used porn and masturbated, or if I used porn and masturbated because I was so anxious and depressed. In either case, abstaining from porn and masturbation (as well as practicing meditation, educating myself on a number of things like the negative effects of PMO, benefits of cognitive behavior therapy, going to see a therapist, etc..) enabled me to clear up my anxiety and depression completely. I was to the point where I was having terrible panic attacks daily and a host of other physical symptoms. I was using porn and masturbation to cope with emotional problems, and it only made things worse and worse and worse.

    I can say with absolute certainty that it was necessary for me to abstain in order to learn or relearn how to experience and process emotions in a healthy way. The problem with using porn to stifle or suppress negative emotions, is that in the process you also suppress ALL emotions, including happiness, empathy, etc... Eliminating porn and masturbation has reopened my access to the full range of human emotions.

    I feel very good. There are stretches of days that are uncomfortable, when I feel like I can't access my emotions, when I do feel some anxiety and slight depression. This is called a flatline, and it is an expected occurrence of withdrawal. It can happen occasionally over the first few years of what is called post-acute withdrawal. Here's a link: http://www.addictionsandrecovery.org/post-acute-withdrawal.htm

    It's likely your fiancé is not the extreme case that I was. This may make it difficult for him to "see" the problem (if indeed there is one) with his behavior. In my case it was obvious and couldn't be ignored.

    I wish you the best of luck. Please keep us posted on any progress or struggles.
     
    WhiteFlower likes this.
  14. Thank you! He does have some (mostly mild) anxiety and depression issues, so that is very interesting.
     
    SMK likes this.
  15. SMK

    SMK Guest

    Those who say M is a physiological need are actually suffering with Stockholm syndrome.
    M within limit is also a myth popularised by Hipsters.
    And yeah.....
    Fighting pmo heals. I m enjoying the happiness,the positive energy n everything. It feels like a victory. Greatest victory of my life.

    Just hv patience. Move structurally n u will reap something good surely.
    All the Best :)
     
  16. Thank you!
     
    SMK likes this.
  17. SMK

    SMK Guest

    M
    Most Welcome. You are free to ask more and get your questions cleared.
     

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