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Catholicism,Calvinism,Reformed Theology & Addiction Debate

A group for members of all religions, or no religion at all, to talk about religion

Feel Good Cool Worship or Hymns and Hard Seats?

  1. Feel Good Cool Worship?

    25.0%
  2. Hymns and Hard Seats?

    50.0%
  3. I don't even care!

    25.0%
  1. But there was. For 1,000s of years humans lived without taxes or governments.
     
  2. Christian Fox

    Christian Fox Fapstronaut

    Yes, but without civilisation
    As I understand it, you personally should not start a revolution but be a good American. To judge the goodness of the American revolution is not up to you or me.
    But I'd say it is good to have been, although maybe not good in itself.
     
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  3. Christian Fox

    Christian Fox Fapstronaut

    But let's get away from politics and back to theology.
     
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  4. Both fair points. You are appreciated.

    A crime on a mass scale doesn't mean it's not a crime. That was my only point. I pay my taxes but I still think its theft. I would prefer we dont do it to each other.

    Civilization couldn't function voluntarily? We have to threaten and coerce to exist?
     
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  5. 3nigma

    3nigma Fapstronaut

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    And life was "nasty, brutish, and short."

    Taxes aren't theft. They're part of the social contract.
     
  6. Ah yes the social contract. "I'll make you an offer you can't refuse". I'll agree to my share of extortion but I'll still call it extortion.

    If I demanded, under threat of violence, my neighbor pay me for "protection" and the right to redress of grievances you'd call my gang a mafia, but what if I said it was part of the contract for being born or owning property in my "hood". Would it be ok?
     
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  7. Christian Fox

    Christian Fox Fapstronaut

    In a sinful world, yes, we have to threaten and coerce.
     
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  8. Bummer. I thought we are to love one another as ourselves.
     
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  9. Blessed are those who threaten and coerce, they shall be called politicians in the kingdom...:)
     
  10. So Icons on your body but not in your church? How are you allowed in the church with icons on your body? :D:p
     
  11. ya know whats wierd is ALOT of reformed people in my church have tats
     
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  12. I think there is some double mindedness going on
     
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  13. Cuz they be hipster Calvinists! j/k I'm a hipster too. LOL!

    hipster.jpg
     
  14. vxlccm

    vxlccm Fapstronaut

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    That pic is :D anachronismic, @Max Fisher

    p.s. Love some of your Libertarian statements, btw. Taxation is theft. I like to ignore the scriptures about how all powers and principalities are actually in God's hand and realistically serve more benefit than harm for us sheeple. I'm glad someone else does most of the grandstanding. I'd never want to be in the shoes of Trump/Hillary/Bush/Obamas/Elizabeth/etc. They may stand accountable for what they've done, but I'd be even worser at it given half a chance to screw up twice as much :p

    One life and family is enough for me to try and lead :)
     
  15. Thanks. I'm Libertarian but practically I prefer a night watch state or some minarchist form of government. I just like arguing the philosophy of taxes because whether we allow it or not, it's still theft. If you believe in the labor theory of property and anything classically liberal then there is really no other word for it. However if we decided to return to the only tax being property tax on land I think we Libertarians would shut up about it :)

    The bibles take on rulers is also interesting. Poland declared Christ the King of their country. A benevolent King, ordained by the church, beloved by the people and honorable like Jon Snow or King Arthur might actually be the ideal form of government, but that is fiction for the most part. I'd gladly submit to a King that was truly worthy and truly good. Maybe an Aragorn?
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Jun 16, 2019
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  16. The Polish church is nuts. They burned "heretical" books including Harry Potter in Gdansk earlier this year.
     
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  17. vxlccm

    vxlccm Fapstronaut

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    Interesting about kings; to agree, in The Book of Mormon it talks about how righteous ones serve people well. The problem is none of them reliably stay that way, and usually each following king is a roll of the dice.

    The American system has worked well for a long time and helped establish a whole better world. Lots of Libertarians trend toward anarchist, or are accused as such. Definitely "minimalism" is what I'd identify with best. Maybe 8% of the government we have now... at least Federal. The states should be able to do what they vote for, but the feds are always meddling with things too much.

    Income tax is okay if there's a sane limit, and a fair tax applied to everyone. Percentages are already fair enough already, the progressive tax concept of subsidizing poorer classes is very harmful. So, flat tax of 8%.

    Property tax does serve society well, too because it requires owners to become productive with their land, and land is a limited resource. I wish I was alive in the era depicted in Far and Away... land to claim and really taste the freedom of the frontier.
     
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  18. I'd agree with most of that. Definately states rights. There should be very little that we as a society should tolerate when it comes to violateling individual liberty and volunteerism. I hate how quick people are willing to violently force other people to do what they want.
     
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  19. Federal govt should provide a strong military. I also think some things like the EPA NTSB are needed on a fed level. but most of our fed budget goes to medicaid and medicare that should be on the states. people have been promised to much.
     
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  20. I'm not big on militaries. Federal or otherwise but I get it.
     

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