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What's stopping rebooting from evolving into a movement?

Discussion in 'Off-topic Discussion' started by Deleted Account, Jan 12, 2016.

  1. Yesodi

    Yesodi Distinguished Fapstronaut

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    Don't mean to be pushy, @Don Draper, but: while @IGY and @taqwa might possibly end up being correct that this NoFap site is not yet ready to go big-time, I see no reason to forcibly close the thread! Dialogue of this nature can have many positive effects -- some of them non-immediate.

    I say: you can "unwatch" this thread if you wish, but let the "forces of nature" (and free-speech) determine its effective lifetime. :)
     
    Last edited: Jan 14, 2016
    Ultra Zork, taqwa and Rav70 like this.
  2. Well, your right. I did get my question about why noFap isn't a social movement and what it lacks. You see, you all were part of an experiment I had devised to understand social movements for my sociology class. We needed to learn what characteristics make up of a social movement.

    Three characteristics are:
    1. There must be a clearly identified opponent. (Not necessarily here because some people are against porn but not masturbation, some against both).
    2. Everyone is connected through a dense informal network (Not correct since the closest personal interactions are IMing through AP partners.
    3. There must be a shared collective identity ( We do have this but since we are all behind a screen, our identity is somewhat disproportionate).
    I'd like to thank all of you for helping my understand my homework. This thread was very insightful to me as well, don't get me wrong. Of course I'll watch this thread, its just that I was hoping for like one response or so.
     
  3. owler

    owler Fapstronaut

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    Something i was thinking about was hitting porn conventions with anti porn stuff, but that probably wouldn't work out too well :/
     
  4. IGY

    IGY Guest

    I agree with the gist of the posts in this thread. NoFap is financially unstable now! It needs people to pay for it now! What I cannot understand is why only is tiny minority of us make a small commitment ($10+) to subscribe. :( It's pathetic.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Jan 14, 2016
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  5. upload_2016-1-14_19-28-21.png
    The hardest part is avoiding the triggers.
    NoFap level: expert.
     
  6. NoBrainer

    NoBrainer Distinguished Fapstronaut

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    Possibly because you need a credit card to make a payment. Banks are hesitant to allow minors to apply and use credit cards these days. And the majority of people on this site (who are under 20 and living at home), would be very hesitant to approach their parents about making a payment, due to the awkward nature of the site. Additionally, there is an expectation when using the internet, that services such as this are free to use. Facebook and youtube are free for example, so why shouldn't nofap be? (this is the opinion of your average consumer). Those sites all rely on advertising for revenue collection. So perhaps @alexander, we could allow for more ads on the site to boost income?
     
  7. NoFap can't be ad supported. I've tried.
    • Ads generally pay peanuts so you need broad appeal and many impressions to make that your primary revenue.
    • We can't use many ad networks because most don't allow advertising on websites with adult subject matter / keywords, or if they allow advertising, they won't display any ads.
    • Additionally, we can't use ad networks because users are easily triggered, and the only way to combat triggering ads is to remove them after they appear. And new ones will always be flooding in. There is no ad moderation with networks. So users would be triggered and I'd be swamped with locating and removing triggering ads as they come in.
    • So that means we need to direct sell ads. Who would buy ads from a site where, as you said, the users are generally young and unwilling to spend money on things online? Advertisers advertise to make money.
    • Who would want to buy ads on a porn recovery website like this?
    • For those who would want to buy ads, do they have advertising budgets?
    • That leaves us with very few potential advertisers to even attempt to sell to. And who knows if they would even be interested.
     
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  8. bearbones

    bearbones Fapstronaut

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    Bro, this ain't exactly the winner's circle... However, I, like yourself, was simply tired of hurting and sick of the same old B.S... which happens to be precisely the right place to start recovery from an addiction.
     
  9. Betamancer

    Betamancer Fapstronaut

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    Places like Nofap will keep on resurfacing as long as the demand for them is there. Even if this site went down, there's always other places to migrate to, like the subreddit. And if those sites went down, a handful of users would likely establish new ones.
     
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  10. Yesodi

    Yesodi Distinguished Fapstronaut

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    In order to facilitate anonymous (or at least cryptographicly-very-strong pseudo-anonymous) payments and/or donations, how about considering the use of BitCoin? More and more mainstream online services (such as WordPress.com) are accepting this as a form of payment.
     
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  11. Yesodi

    Yesodi Distinguished Fapstronaut

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    Regarding ads paying peanuts and requiring broad appeal, if the sight could somehow survive financially until a large threshold of non-paying viewer count were reached, these ads suddenly could become a not-insignificant source of revenue.

    As to who would already want to buy direct ads on a sight like this, I already see ads for CovenantEyes. And I imagine that many other similar entities exist -- for example, in the fields of:
    • addiction-related products, services, and agencies -- not just porn-related
    • Psychology-, mental-health-, and self-improvement-related publications and services
    • Maybe, if the site is open-minded enough, despite being a secular site: religious organizations.
    I imagine that many other opportunities exist as well. With all due respect to the blessed NoFap staff, maybe it needs to somehow obtain additional manpower resource dedicated to, and knowledgeable in, "businesses development"?
     
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  12. Yesodi

    Yesodi Distinguished Fapstronaut

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    @alexander : Another possible avenue to explore is "big-league" philanthropy.

    I don't know how appropriate it is to mention "competing" websites, but there is a Jewish religious site called GuardYourEyes.com, that also offers an amazing array of services (including counseling!) all for FREE.

    All of this is clearly funded by private philanthropy, and might serve NoFap as a model for emulation.

    BTW: I personally do not view this and similar websites as "competing," but rather as complementary. And there might even be room for cooperation, mutual links, ... etc.
     
    Caveat Emptor likes this.
  13. Religious organizations rack in a ton of money through other means. As a secular website, NoFap does not have access to those sorts of resources.

    People don't get free things without strings attached or ulterior motives at work. Also, I'd rather not further perpetuate the idea that everything in life should be free. Counseling and services cost time and money to develop and operate, and that money has to come from somewhere. Many addicts and younger people don't think about the person on the other side sacrificing their time and resources to make these things available. And we don't have massive religious organizations funneling money to us like other websites have the benefit of.
     
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  14. I like this idea.
     
    Yesodi likes this.
  15. 1. It has become a part of the anti-pornography movement, which has been around since the 1970's. XxxChurch has been involved since the mid-2000's, so the anti-masturbation component is nothing new.

    2. Masturbation is essentially the final frontier in the sexual revolution. People don't like talking about it, but a dialogue needs to be opened, lest people think it's something shameful and "unhealthy". It's not either of those things, but it has been made unhealthy due to certain social and religious stigmas.
     
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  16. Caveat Emptor

    Caveat Emptor Distinguished Fapstronaut

    I think it's hard to make this a big story/movement because it's such a personal struggle. People understandably don't like to talk about it. Like many others have said, there are probably millions of people out there who are negatively affected by their PMO habits, but have no idea about it, and people who are trying to quit, and don't realize like resources like this exist.

    I also think it is part a larger, albeit quiet, movement, along with organizations like Fight the New Drug, YourBrainonporn.org, yourbrainrebalanced.org, etc. that are spreading awareness about porn addiction from a secular perspective.
    And then there are other more established organizations like Morality in Media, which are often religiously motivated, that would approve of nofap, but I'm not sure how working or being affiliated with them would work.

    All that being said, I also think the best way to spread awareness and prevent future addicts is through education, and I think that's something that we may be able to implement on a large scale, as part of public school sex education, within our lifetime. Some organizations, namely Fight the New Drug, already do this on a volunteer basis at schools that are willing to host them, and I believe some European countries do this too, although I'm not entirely sure about that.

    But until this belief and philosophy that porn is harmful takes hold organically on a large scale, the best way to grow "the movement" is just to casually bring it up when a conversation turns to the topic of porn. "You know, I quit porn a couple years ago and it's been one of the best decisions of my life." And if your friend inquires more, tell them as much as they'd like to know, and if they laugh at you or whatever, then ignore it. Who cares? You know what works for you, and anyone who thinks less of you for it probably isn't worth knowing anyway. I don't think that's proselytizing or being pushy. It's being honest in a natural conversation, and people tend to appreciate that.
     
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  17. Caveat Emptor

    Caveat Emptor Distinguished Fapstronaut

    Also, on the subject of finances, NoFap skews young, and young people don't have a lot of disposable income.

    I'm a 24 year old full time grad student. I have no income. I'm in tens of thousands of dollars of debt.
    I donated and was a premium member before starting between undergrad and grad school, when I had an income.
    Times are tough, and as great as nofap is, food, shelter, school, etc, comes first. And in four years when I get that awesome job with a livable, disposable income, you bet I'm gonna be donating regularly to NoFap! I wouldn't be in grad school if NoFap hadn't of convinced me to get my $#!+ together. But until then, is it wrong to expect the over 30 group to front the bill? I honestly don't know how I feel about that. But perhaps we should ask more of older fapstronauts.
    Not require more. Hell no. Just ask more. With a sticky or something in the appropriate journal sections or something.
     
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  18. Drift

    Drift Fapstronaut

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    I'm in the same boat giggle (well a little ahead in the process, just out of gradschool), but I definitely relate because I have no money or steady job atm. So, what little 10/month is, I can't afford it, but I am doing it anyway and hoping things work out.

    It'd be a huge void in my chance to build a healthy routine and implement personal change if we lost this website and community environment.

    I think the school volunteer aspect is possibly really helpful. Maybe there's a chance for an adhoc subcommittee to form that could develop that idea. Just having one day in a classroom that could speak to healthy relationships, not objectifying other people for sex needs, and then the impacts of porn and other addictions on your brain/life would be a really excellent outreach moment.

    When I was growing up sex was such a Taboo topic in my family that we never discussed it, or dating, or anything like that. It was just all wrapped up in "bad". Sex ed was more aimed at anatomy and how to use a condom. Nothing at all that debunked porn and objectifying behavior or promoted more healthy relationships.

    While I realize we are secular, and I appreciate that a great deal, would that preclude us from asking for support from non-secular allies? Money has no morals or values, and where ever we get it from, as long as they respect our right to exist independently and approach porn our way, why would it matter if donors are religious or not if both parties are being respected and able to do their work? I mean NoFap offers a tailor made forum approach where any one can make a group of any kind, so why re-invent the wheel if you're a spiritual organization that is interested in this work, when you can contribute to a great looking,well functioning NoFap community.

    I guess I just see it like a typical NGO or Nonprofit setup, where people donate to support a cause and the organization, but respect that that organization has it's own board and way of running itself. I'm not naive that I don't recognize people who contribute money can feel a need to have a say in how it's spent or derive a direct benefit from the donation (campaign contributions of course), but that completely defeats the definition of a gift.
     
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